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yash i dont see the funny side...?
[size=9]I NEVER WORE IT BECAUSE OF THE TALIBAN, MOTHER. I LIKE THE [b]MODESTY[/b] AND [b]PROTECTION[/b] IT AFFORDS ME FROM THE EYES OF MEN.[/size] [url=http://www.adherents.com/lit/comics/Dust.html]Dust, X-Men[/url]
well i don't encourage parents to hit their kids, or to go to the point of abusing them in such a way that they could be hurt. But kids these days are so ungrateful and spoilt. They intentionally play up sometimes, especially in the Uk and you'll often hear them say go on then dad i dare you to hit me, i'll call the police and get you locked up. . If this smug attitude isn't a mark of disrespect and ingrattitude to the person who bore you what is? You can only provoke ppl up to a certain level then they will flip. I guess this man in the airport flipped.
Cases of child abuse is very different i'm not saying i support that. But them spoilt kids.
only heartless people take "revenge" out on little kids :roll:
I believe I have an illegitimate uncle somewhere in Pakistan, curse him.
what do u mean :?:
My Aunty, was raped by a Pakistani solider in 1971- she gave birth to “his” son.
oh my... :?
has personal exp made u hate Pakistan and all things related to it?
I don’t hate Pakistan - considering million's of innocent Bengalis where massacred- it would be understandable if I felt any animosity towards the average Pakistani in London, this it wouldn’t achieved nothing expect for pleasing the Shaytaan - but the Sharia doesn’t allow one’s imam to be governed by his anger.
i went to pakistan this yeari didnt like my village people, always pokin there noses cmin sittin around to look for future daughter in laws and the place was crawling with soliders who were livin in huts in the mountains opposite our houses. i didnt like it there and icame back three days later, but i got to admit the scenery was beautiful.
thats being a little paranoid
Back in BLACK
i can somewhat understand ur sentitments
i can relate to the women who end up hating men after they've been raped/abused by them
so even if u did hate all Paki's it wud be kinda understandable
I’m intrepid traveler- most of the countries I have visited have been 3rd /2nd world countries- considering how better off we are compare to them, we should truly be grateful to Allah to have put us in this position, if your relatives behavior may appear a little peculiar – look a little harder at the scenery and the daily struggle for the villager’s.
And besides there is a Hadith, which mention the reward of marrying a poor person, taking them out of poverty, this has been interpreted as bring them to the UK for example where the standard of living is better then Pakistan.
This is happening all to often, once our parents have left this world, will we still have blood ties with our relations back home?
Well I get accuse of being a racist on a forum, I always reply with “those who don’t learn from history are doomed to repeat it”
I don’t hate Pakistani, I've spent to much time being bitter.
do u really think most guys who marry girls from back home marry them for the noble reasons u've stated above?
I dont speak for every brother- that’s one of my reasons personally for getting married. She is living in a war zone!
I've given an testimony from my friend in a previous thread, to the reason why he opted to find a bride from his native country, he is a pious brother and good husband to his wife- his reason are exactly what I have mention above- to take the woman (now his wife) out of poverty…May Allah reward him.
I don’t want to compare who is more holier: Muslim here or back home, each individual is different
No it wouldn't, why should it be, why should today pakistani take resonsibility for teh action of pakistani in the past. No person has a reason to be bitter toward a group of people, unless they deserve it. It was this small minded attitude that was present in some of teh elder generation where they woudn't let a fued that began centeries ago disappear and prevent the spirit of brotherhood existing in the muslims today.
"A true Muslim is thankful to Allah in prosperity, and resigned to His will in adversity."
[url=http//www.guidancemedia.com/videostream.php?id=Burda.mov]Quran[/url]
I’ve think you’ve not understand Muslim sister post and the point she is making, if my aunty hated all men or just Pakistani in general- she would understand because of the ordeal he has faced in being raped, whether that is wrong or right- put yourself in the victim shoes.
You’ve answered your own question, today’s Pakistan doesn’t even recognise the genocide ever happened nor has offered any apology- it happened 35 years ago, only 35 years and yet no senior Pakistani General has been brought to justice- all the 1971 war criminals are very much alive today in Pakistan.
I do not wish to derail this topic into a 1971 debate- such a thread already exist
:?::evil:
Lets keep our heads firmly in the sand and ignore injustices within our history!
I understand where Shazan is coming from on this issue.
The same happens in many counties, like in Serbia where most people either deny any war crimes happened or try and brush it under the carpet and refuse to discuss it at all. That causes great resentment and animosity.
In regards to 1971, the terrible events should be taught in Pakistani schools as a prime example of what happens when nationalism and hatred goes out of control, it should not be a taboo subject that people are not prepared to talk about.
Assalam alaikum
What you have written is no less then the awful truth and the reality of confronting genocide, my Chechen friends visit a Russian forum and translate what is being posted, incredibly public opinion in Russia is denying the genocide which is happening in Chechnya now. This is all to common.
A blood of an innocent Muslim means more to Allah then the Kabba.
This disease of nationalism and tribalism must end.
How much does education make a difference?
To compare to the postwar South for a very long time it looked like it would finally destroy racism - but organizations like the Klan have adapted and consequently are still powerful. Now they attempt a scholarly approach, arguing they are an organization that looks out for the interests of white people, who have been forgotten in Federal programs like affirmative action - this is the David Duke approach. On top of that we have revisionist histories like "Gone with the Wind" which attempt to erase if not explain the racism of the South. It's dangerous and it's found an audience - so it seems like this all comes from somewhere else.
We had show trials, anti segregation education - integration, but the racists adapted.
And Bosnia is worse off since you mentioned all the intellectuals fled before the war, and a new breed of "intellectual" creeped up to feed the population intellectual racism.
I think you mentioned a year or so ago that the Serb hatred is growing back in Serbia - or never left.
I am not familiar with Pakistan/Bangladesh - but I suspect that similar dynamics are at work.
So understanding the need for Justice - and certainly not saying that Trials or Education should be stepped aside, what effective tools do either of you see to preventing this from happening again?
People are getting married again in Bosnia - That's hopeful.
Similar to you not being familiar with Pakistan/Bangladesh history, I’m ignorant on racism in the South and past KKK crimes, but I have seen steps being made to bring formal KKK leaders to justice and only recently a formal Baptist member of the KKK has been found guilty (hopefully you’ll be familiar with this case). Similar steps are needed to bring all war criminals to justice.
Right - as a matter of justice they are brought to trial when we catch them committing crimes.
Unfortunately the "show trial" aspect which was meant to demonstrate to the population racist crimes are not going to be tolerated hasn't stemmed the actual racism to any major degree.
It seems incurable with education and criminal action, i'm not sure why.
I think you are talking about Edgar Ray Killen by the way. The ordained minister and KKK leader in the 60s who was involved in the killings of those three civil rights activists in Mississippi.
That's still a dangerous state in some parts... I wouldn't go there if you paid me.
But even his trial didn't really have much affect - the new klan looks back on them and turns their noses up as just backwoods hicks. They prefer to think of themselves as "European-American intellectuals."
There is a appetite within America to bring formal KKK members to justice- a move which is supported by you and must echo general public opinion= feelings towards these self appointed righteous racist?
This is non-existence in Pakistan, as latifah said it’s a taboo subject, I see the unwillingness from Pakistan because it cant possibly understand the suffering it has inflected on Bangladeshi in 1971.
Education is important because those who don’t learn from history and their past mistake are doomed to repeat it- and history is our biggest teacher.
Bro, u got it all wrong, if first thing lilsis said, u not ur aunty. Second thing is why should my bengali mate hate me for a genocide that existed before i was born and till today i never heard about. It not a case of me burying my head in the sand, at the end of the day, being pakistani is something i born into, islam is something I choose. To me being pakistani is inrevelant and mean nothing so i feel i don't need to say sorry as a pakistani. At the end of the day as a muslim and a human being I can condemn the action, but thats it. Because all muslims country got blood on their hands as far as i know. Your first couple of comment on the subject were just about right IMO.
"A true Muslim is thankful to Allah in prosperity, and resigned to His will in adversity."
[url=http//www.guidancemedia.com/videostream.php?id=Burda.mov]Quran[/url]
That's true... I suppose without the education policies we wouldn't discuss it at all and revert back to the 50s.
I suppose Pakistan and the Balkans are much more complicated in this respect.
And in one other - I don't get the feeling the Pakistan lost the war, or at least not like German '46 or the Confederacy 1865. Is that correct?
Because being defeated and conquered most definitely changes peoples opinions quickly - If the South hadn't lost as bad as we did I suspect it would be a nightmare today.
Right but if you read his post more clearly he says all that - all he is asking for from Pakistan is an apology and recognition that it happened, and that the perpetrators, who he clearly singles out as generals and individuals rather than the nation itself, be brought to justice.
How is that unreasonable or detrimental to muslim unity?
If I hated those who oppressor my family in 1971, that is wrong?
This is why I get called a racist and views become polarised in honest debates, because I loathe the Pakistani Military and it’s current dictator somehow my arguments are debunked and are equated to being racist towards Pakistani.
I'm not advocating you hate anyone, I don’t like Pakistani nationalist or them shoveling his or her nationalist rhetoric down my throat or bringing it to the Masjid.
Alhamdulilah………….. You are better then I…….
What was the point of the last comment, no one talking about being better then the other :?
Second thing is that, i can't stand the pakistan governement as well, but they no better then or worse then any other muslim country, they all got blood on their hands, especially of other muslims.
And Augustus
This is the part i didn't get, it all fair asking the people who commited the act to be account for it, I fully behind that and these people should be brought to justice. But why should this generation of pakistani need to apologies and take responsbilty for a act that they had nothing to do with. I get along fine with my Bengai muslim brothers, the question of politic has never come into anything and we treat ech other like muslim brothers.
"A true Muslim is thankful to Allah in prosperity, and resigned to His will in adversity."
[url=http//www.guidancemedia.com/videostream.php?id=Burda.mov]Quran[/url]
Pakistan failed to subdue the Bangladeshi movement for independence from west Pakistan- as result commited mass genocide, and lost Kashmir to India. Land which is considered to be part of Pakistan
I understand, but I think I am reading this in light of his perspective as a victim of a hate crime, and his comments regarding the importance of education in protecting against crimes of hatred.
Consequently while there is no connection other than by birth between this generation of Pakistanis and the previous - it does not mean they aren't suceptable to the same hatred that corrupted their parents, and it is important to know and recognize it's effects in preventing it in the future. I'm not reading his response as interpreting "responsibility" as guilt - but rather as inheriting a duty to prevent it in the future.
As you pointed out you are Pakistani by accident of birth - and while you bare no guilt, you have a stake in the continued development of your culture, and accepting the mistakes of that culture in the past - to secure it does not betray its moral precepts in the future, is a duty you share with all Pakistanis of any generation.
Just like I am not personally guilty for intolerance against blacks - I know it has existed in my culture and I must be vigilant to prevent its return.
Good post, I agree. But it just my opinion that as muslims, the bengali and pakistani share a special bond between each other, for this bond to increase, it my personal opinion that what has happen in the past stay in the past, as does the politic. This is how i kept a 20 year friendship with alot of my bengali mates. Basically what i saying, is moving the pakistani's and bengali's away from their nationailist roots, by the concept of brotherhood of islam.
"A true Muslim is thankful to Allah in prosperity, and resigned to His will in adversity."
[url=http//www.guidancemedia.com/videostream.php?id=Burda.mov]Quran[/url]
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