did nothing happen before the saturday?

the tensions arose from nowhere?

were the blacks jus 'monkeyin' about and felt like causin trouble?

i doubt it.....

not sayin theyre innocent, i dont think theres an innocent party in the whole affair........not sure abut saturday tho, depends if the rape took place

hayder bro its clear to me u dnt knw whats happened and nor do u knw what has been happening. so i dnt think theres much point in me saying much cos ur not aware of whats happened.

u keep believing what u like bro.,

salaam.

yup

ive seen riots in oldham, far greater than those in B'ham - theres a lotta people and things to blame. it aint ever that simple

i believe your racist

w/salaam

hayder bro your quick to call us racist and blame pakis but the true facts are we were innocent in this

hayder it appears you dont know nothing , learn true facts , trying telling the innocent injured taxi driver who was beaten and car blown up

please if there are any blacks in the forum , i love to hear your views brothers

i never said whos innocent or guilty

your comments have been very racist, whether you meant it or not

and its not only me who thought that is it

"Darth V-Hayder" wrote:

did nothing happen before the saturday?

the tensions arose from nowhere?

were the blacks jus 'monkeyin' about and felt like causin trouble?

i doubt it.....

not sayin theyre innocent, i dont think theres an innocent party in the whole affair........not sure abut saturday tho, depends if the rape took place

dont doubt it , they felt like causing trouble

yes there is an innocent party , the innocent hurt muslims

and no rape took place all fabricated lies

what ever i said you thought were racist point it out to me, please ill defend myself or apologise

yes the ones hurt are always innocent, that i agree with

but something must have made them act in such a way...?

i doubt they felt like causing riots

"Raf786" wrote:

what ever i said you thought were racist point it out to me, please ill defend myself or apologise

its a lil late now, gotta be up 4 sehri and uni 2mrw now

never mind

Allah Hafiz bro

come up oldham yeah, 4get irf

"Med" wrote:

lol, bro I said pakis arent KNOWN to be muggers etc. Meaning we dont have that rep, we dnt have that stereotype etc.

well not really abt devalidating my point. Cos its clear from whats going on that the blacks ARE jealous of the muslim businesses etc. What it does prove, in my view atleast, is that the negative ideas I have about blacks is correct.

I gave example b4 abt my skul. I think most of the 10/15 pakis that we were at kes, most of us were on Government assisted place. Now some are in cambrdige, some oxford, some are medics, some dentals, some engineers, some mathematicians etc.We, including myself, come from so called disadvantaged backgrounds, but enough of us managed to get gud into gud skul, to get places in gud unis. Whats stopping the blacks?

Bro I had a beard and applied for medsun and got 2 offers alhamdulillah, I applied for dentistry a yr later and my beard was even longer and got another offer. And this was after 9/11. So the excuse that ppl discriminate isnt really toostrong. Yes these things do happen, but certainly it aint as systematic or widespread as blacks make out.

If a muslim, with full beard cna apply and be offered medsuna dn dentistry places after 9/11 i dnt c any problem with blacks achieving the same thing.

I think ive said all i can on this issue, bro.im a lil tired.

k, salaam.

salaams
i am a black practsing brother from london now residing in b'ham who have read all the comments and am deeply offended. brothers if you are practsing fully and have true iman then i would suggest you all repent for such racist comments as Allah knows the truth in the matter. ask your self if our Nabi was here today would he accept such comments from amoung his community. FEAR ALLAH!
by the way i live in handsworth in b'ham and also can see whats going on. when i moved to b'ham 1yr ago the first thing i felt was the racial tension on both sides which made me wish to return back to london. there is racism amoung the black community and racism among the asian community. including the muslim community a lot of black brothers feel isolated as well in b'ham because of the tension from the blacks who reject them slightly, and the hidden racism within the masjids which you may not feel? i am usually excluded and some times treated like an alien by some ignorant muslims this is a real problem which many face who are reverts reguardless of being black or white etc. at present i am getting bad vibes from some brothers in the masjid who now look at me with distrust either way i have found it is better to just pray there as that is why i attend the masjid and to keep away from the fitnah. i would defend the same guys if need be. however there is so much racial tension and some ppl there were boasting of what weapons they had on them. inshAllah it will die down i hope and there would be no need for ppl to fight each other as this is what shaytan wants! the elders in my masjid only made the situation worse by putting ppl into a state of moral panick along with the media which helped lead to even more tension.
when there is fitnah it is best to stay away from it and seek refuge with Allah as shaytan is clearly at work here.
i am married to a pakistani sister and we both recieve racism from both communities what hurts more though is so called practisng muslims who are racist as they should know better. also there is also tension and gang warfare between somalis and pakistani youth for control of areas. i have seen this first hand as i work with youngsters who have been excluded from schools etc. i have taught and continue to teach martial arts to both communities here and have found that through teaching attitudes towards violence changes. i have meet some very good and honest brothers here also who are well aware of the many problems even before this madness took place.
i am from brixton in london and we have had bigger riots than this riot however races in brixton mix better than in handsworth lozells etc and some parts of b'ham.
be at the forfront of bringing dawah to the blacks here as they need to be less ignorant and at the same time work on ppl in the asian community also who are unaware of the racism that is holding us back as muslims as well. a pious looking person dosen't mean they aren't racist i mean would most of them marry their daugthers to a good practising brother reguardless his race?
my family are non muslim and when they came to visit me in b'ham they did not like the way ppl stuck to their own kind.
unfortunatly there are some parts of london that are similar.
there should not be a bengaloi mosque, a somali mosque or a pakistani mosque. but just a masjid! full stop!
in brixton islam is spreading very very rapidly amoungst all the ethnic communities and i have found that reverts naturally give up their cultural ties and wipe the slate clean and do impressive stuff which go un noitced.
Umar (RA) was more concerned for ppl in this ummah that were born muslim than for those who accepted islam.
check whats happening in america etc.
to heal any problem is true islam
only true islam can change things Allah guides whom he wills and mis guides whom he wills.
i have seen first hand islam change communities.
salaams all
may Allah helps and keep us upon the straight path!

brothers lots of ppl who were taken to the americas during the colonial period suffered bad etc. may i point out that in the caribbean there are lots of asians from the caribbean who are in the same ruck as black ppl are in. the british also brought them there from her empire! it's called mental slavery and was also called "seasoning" in which the colonials had to destroy their mind and family structure by extreme brain washing.
don't take my word for it read and find out more. the islamic culture amoung the slaves was destroyed and they were forced to accept christianity. they could only sing etc and some disguised their martial arts this way hence brazilian caporeia. they were denied education etc. it is different from the british intervention of india and china etc. what happened in the america was slave against master.
black people also have themselves to blame as it was some of their african fore fathers who helped sell them into slavery. the arabs also played a part in a slavery that differed from the time of our Nabi. therefore caribbeans and black americans look at ppl with a slight distrust.
.
black ppl culture has been deliberatly attacked in america since the americans feared they was a communist uprising in the communities. please find out for yourselves. if the culture being imported from amerca is affecting asian and white youths imagine the damaging affect on black youths who see these stupid role models etc.
remember malcolm x saw through these race games and wanted america to see true islam. the west has had interaction with islam many times don't believe it's a new thing they have been here before. however ppl need dawah irrespective of race. it is only islam that can help them that
by the way when a black non muslim approaches me because of my islamic attire and they feel that they can speak they usually ask me "how do they accept you?"
when i explain to them that there is no racism in islam they relax more and are open to listen and ask so many questions about islam out of genuine interest.
i have had the same question phrased differently from white non muslims so many times.
in which i give a similar answer along with dawah.
we need to take islam to each community and show them it's beauty as they feel isloated from us because we have not been doing our job as muslims fully.

when i became muslim i was so happy to find that i now had brothers and sisters of every single race plus the biggest family in the world! mashAllah!

May Allah forgive us!

"anis" wrote:

salaams
i am a black practsing brother from london now residing in b'ham who have read all the comments and am deeply offended. brothers if you are practsing fully and have true iman then i would suggest you all repent for such racist comments as Allah knows the truth in the matter. ask your self if our Nabi was here today would he accept such comments from amoung his community. FEAR ALLAH!
!

welcome to the forum

i apologise for the racist/pig ignorant backwards comments u came across on this thread

some people are experts at assumping/generalising and making stuff up

they have no weight or evidence to back back their comments up

dont worry-as you'll find in this forum-their views are in the minorities and strongly disgreed by MOST members here

its good to see a black muslim brother on this forum-and I will agree with u that racism is very strong amongst the Paki muslim community

hopefully this racism will one day diminish and meanwhile u can work on getting rid of this stupid sterotype on black people-

muslims too have to work on their sterortypical image conveyed in the media

anyways-I'm waffling on here

but welcome to the forum

and dont take to heart the racism and ignorance that u may encounter in this forum

[size=18]Rumours and riots[/size]

[size=14]Economic inequalities are driving events in Birmingham. Solidarity must be our response [/size]

[b]Salma Yaqoob[/b]
Tuesday October 25, 2005
[url=http://www.guardian.co.uk/comment/story/0,3604,1599734,00.html]The Guardian [/url]

Having witnessed events in Birmingham over the past few days, I see an alarming picture emerging. Not only have there been two deaths, scores of people injured and property damaged, but I have been taken aback at the breathtaking irresponsibility of some community representatives. Instead of calming the situation, they have inflamed it.

It is important to be conscious of the impact of language and scrupulous about verifying facts. Where there are acknowledged to be "simmering tensions" in an area, the responsibility is even greater on community leaders to exercise care. Yet if one traces events to the trigger of the weekend riots - the alleged rape of a Jamaican girl by Asian men - the opposite has been the case.

Despite now admitting he had no proof or facts, DJ Warren G aired the allegation on his radio talkshow last Tuesday, going as far as to organise a demonstration outside the shop where the alleged rape was said to have taken place. The message that went round the community was one of a black woman needing to be protected against "Asians" rather than individual criminals. At a second demonstration on Saturday, community representatives were calling for Asian shops to be boycotted.

Both communities suddenly felt they were under attack from the other. Businesses were attacked and hundreds of youths took to the streets to "protect" "their" communities. It was clear even at community representatives' meetings on Sunday that emotions were dangerously out of control. Many were unable to comprehend that people from both communities shared similar feelings of vulnerability and fear.

There is a vacuum in local Asian leadership. And while many from the African-Caribbean community were determined the situation be contained, a small but vocal group seemed more interested in repeating inflammatory warnings of a "race war". Resentment was present before the alleged rape. There has been a widespread perception among the African-Caribbean community that Asians are doing well at their expense, and rumours that Asians receive more public funding. If public funding grants in north-west Birmingham are examined, African-Caribbean projects have received the largest proportion. Millions have been invested in helping black enterprise and training projects. The Sikh community received one substantive European grant, and the Pakistanis and Bangladeshis have received the least.

In the aftermath of the violence we will no doubt be subject to more debates on "multiculturalism" and "integration". The truth is that it is economic inequalities - real and imagined - that are driving events in Birmingham. Its inner-city wards are among the most deprived in the country, and all the those living there - white, black, Asian - are disadvantaged.

To find a way out of this crisis, representatives from all the communities must come together and demand the resources that the area needs. The political system has encouraged competition between different disadvantaged communities for what amounts to crumbs. This has been compounded by the role of the Liberal Democrat-Tory coalition that runs Birmingham city council and has increased pressure to divert resources from inner-city areas to more affluent suburbs. Meanwhile, the macho attitude shown across our communities in recent days has made women less safe. Tomorrow, women from both communities will march together to demonstrate our common interests: solidarity, not racism, is the answer.

· Salma Yaqoob is a community mediator in Birmingham, spokeswoman for Birmingham Central mosque and vice-chair of Respect

salaams to you all i hope that the communities all come together and put this behind them.

waslams

"anis" wrote:

salaams to you all i hope that the communities all come together and put this behind them.

waslams

Wa-salam, thanks for your posts, they were very insightful, a few ppl can learn from them.

Welcome to the forum, hope to see you post more.

These are the banners I've been talking about, if anyone's interested.

[img]http://img479.imageshack.us/img479/487/40943968rapesign2031fi.jpg[/img]

salaan Anis,
your comments have been very interesting and excellent to read. I am sorry you feel some of our comments were racists if there were from me i apologise bro, and that you feel excluded from some ignorant muslims. I agree 100% with your comments espeically that the mosques should be for all muslims, not pakistani,bangali,somali mosques. Malcolm X was a great man and a hero to me , I advise many to go read his biography. I also feal convert or revert muslims are the best muslims who learn islam for its true meaning and dont have any culture to corrupt them. I wish all brothers were as learned and knowledgeable as you. I hope to hear more from you in this forum.

what martial arts do you teach?
where is it?

i live close to handsworth and would love to join a martial arts thought by a muslim brother after ramadhan

Salaam Brother Anis

im glad you posted what you had to say, maybe it can enlighten some of the people here the reality of the situation and how deep racism is in our communities

i totally agree with everyword you said, a lot of pakistanis (especially elders) are not very open to other colours, even tho they maybe muslims

they seem to think Islam is an asian thing - all literature and talks are done in urdu, and its not very helpful if your new to Islam or from a diffrent background

agreed on the idea of a mosque for all

it reminds me of a sad situation of a Black brother i know, he was extremely surprised how he was shown much love in the cmmunity when he embraced Islam - however when he was looking for a wife, every1 was reluctant to allow him to marry them his duaghters

why? coz he wasnt pakistani. thats stupid mentality. all that should matter is his Piety, and believe me - hes a very sincere brother

anyways, glad you could give us the view from the other side

Welcome and hpe you enjoy your stay brother

Hayder

"Darth V-Hayder" wrote:

they seem to think Islam is an asian thing - all literature and talks are done in urdu, and its not very helpful if your new to Islam or from a diffrent background

I've heard that the only masjid in Birmingham that does khutbas in english is the salafi one run by Abu Khadijah. Is this true?

no idea, ive only witnessed Talks in English at Jummah time at one place, Uni prayer room

i try understandin the Urdu, i can follow it pretty well but its very easy to switch off

"Raf786" wrote:

salaan Anis,
your comments have been very interesting and excellent to read. I am sorry you feel some of our comments were racists if there were from me i apologise bro, and that you feel excluded from some ignorant muslims. I agree 100% with your comments espeically that the mosques should be for all muslims, not pakistani,bangali,somali mosques. Malcolm X was a great man and a hero to me , I advise many to go read his biography. I also feal convert or revert muslims are the best muslims who learn islam for its true meaning and dont have any culture to corrupt them. I wish all brothers were as learned and knowledgeable as you. I hope to hear more from you in this forum.

ditto Anis bro.

Salaam.

Sun is warm. Grass is green. Alhamdulillah.

Birds are singing, and how I am now I have never been. Alhamdulillah

Those 2 posts above have got what relevance to do with the riots? :roll:

Neway whats the latest on the riots? gotten worse/better?

salaams i hope you all are well?
i know of i think only 2 or 3 places in whole of b'ham that does the talks in english. possibly just two i can be wrong as i am still new to b'ham. if you guys know of other places that do talks in english please let me know. i know that green lane masjid does talks every so often.

the martial arts i teach is called "quwwa" which is arabic for strength and power. i put this art together after studying kung fu and looking into various martial arts.

the film is shot in b'ham and is a little cheesy! originally me and some brothers and ex-students wanted to have a bit of fun play fighting on camera. anyway i made friends with a turkisk MMA fighter "sami the hun" berik who fights on sky and we decided to have a bit of fun and put a message in it as i just arrived in b'ham etc and wanted to portray how a person see's problems in his new surroundings . nothing serious if you wanna find out more drop me an email on dranis23@hotmail.com

anyway inshAllah we'll all learn from one another i am always open to learn and share knowledge with people. salaams and please forgive me as my intention was no to talk about my outside pursuits like martial arts i only wrote it in originally to show my connection with the young people over the years.

salaams

other ppl who revert r much better than myself and practise islam better than me inshAllah i am happy Allah has forgiven my past sins but i still have a long way to go.

Salam

In Lozells area of Birmingham, there was a rumour that a Muslim from the local shop had raped a 14 year old black girl. Then a local pirate radio station went on air and said that it was a gang rape. Then all hell broke loose at 5 pm, on Saturday 22 October 2005. All night young boys fought with each other. Gangs came out and rioted on the street of the city. Knives were used. Petrol bombs were thrown. Mosque was attacked. Police officers were shot at. Boys were stabbed. So far two people have been killed.

Community leaders were useless, as ever.

Police did most of the excellent work in calming the situation.

Omrow

[size=18]Websites and radio stations face charges for inciting riot[/size]

Detectives were last night looking at the possibility of prosecuting some of the owners of websites and pirate radio stations blamed for sparking riots in Birmingham that left one man dead and dozens injured.

An unsubstantiated rumour that a 14-year-old Jamaican girl was raped by up to 19 Asian men was seen as the catalyst for the violent clashes between black and Asian gangs at the weekend.

The rumour was heavily publicised on the Afro-Caribbean underground radio stations Hot FM and Sting FM, both based in Birmingham.

It was also broadcast on the websites BlacknetUK and Supatrax.

Yesterday officers said they were gathering evidence and were looking at whether the published comments could be considered to incite racial hatred.

[url=http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2005/10/26/nbirm26....