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Yeah I know we should try to forget the last few days on Mpac, but Alhamdulilah this debate on revival forum and its adab is good.... no its better then good it in accordance with the teachings of Quran and Sunnah.
I pretty much agree with everything Dust has mention.
i understand you Dust but why would such a thing which is not compulsory be compulsory for some. surely it is a choice one makes, and has a right to make.
But one cannot present personal choices as compulsory and expect laws to be changed on this basis.
people who believe the jilbab to be fardh have not made it compulsory [i]themselves[/i], but they have read quraanic ayaat, ahadith and scholarly opinions which suggest this view. therefore, to them it is as much a 'personal choice' as praying salaah.
u will find differences of opinion on many matters in Islam, this is nothing new. Islam embraces diversity and scholars have evidence from the quran and ahadith to back their opinions. if we did not have diversity in the interpretation of Quran and Ahadith, the four madhabs would not exist. some things that are considered fardh among the shafi'i, may not be considered fardh by hanafis - its a difference of opinion, but neither is wrong as long as they can support their stance through the Quran and Sunnah. Allah is the ultimate Judge.
[size=9]I NEVER WORE IT BECAUSE OF THE TALIBAN, MOTHER. I LIKE THE [b]MODESTY[/b] AND [b]PROTECTION[/b] IT AFFORDS ME FROM THE EYES OF MEN.[/size] [url=http://www.adherents.com/lit/comics/Dust.html]Dust, X-Men[/url]
Kamilah: Jazakillah khair sis, sweet of u to say that, but any truth in what i wrote is from Allah, and any mistakes were of my own doing.
pity about the Mpac thread, so is it locked now? got that bad huh? Khamzat u shudda mentioned it before, i might've joined the mpac forum just to post on that thread, lol.
[size=9]I NEVER WORE IT BECAUSE OF THE TALIBAN, MOTHER. I LIKE THE [b]MODESTY[/b] AND [b]PROTECTION[/b] IT AFFORDS ME FROM THE EYES OF MEN.[/size] [url=http://www.adherents.com/lit/comics/Dust.html]Dust, X-Men[/url]
Sister I’m glad I didn’t mention it, I wouldn’t want respectful sister to witness such torture they vilified everyone who agreed the jilbab is Fardh and especially this sister (Shabina begum) and ironically is a member of the Mpac forum !
i am not easily 'tortured'. :twisted: did u say shabina is a member of the mpac forum? so was she participating in that thread?
[size=9]I NEVER WORE IT BECAUSE OF THE TALIBAN, MOTHER. I LIKE THE [b]MODESTY[/b] AND [b]PROTECTION[/b] IT AFFORDS ME FROM THE EYES OF MEN.[/size] [url=http://www.adherents.com/lit/comics/Dust.html]Dust, X-Men[/url]
Correct she is a member of the forum but she didn’t participate in the debate, which made it even more worst- all the backbiting and considering one of her cousin is member of the forum, reading such slander against his cousin is cruel.
Should I try to get Shabina to join the revival forum?
lol sure!
But maybe we should delete all the threads about her first... something about all this just doesn't seem right. There has been a lot of judgement passed on the girl without her getting a say in the matter and well... just something doesn't seem right about that.
Seems indecent or something - she's a person, not an issue... and I didn't like the way MPAC turned her into an issue, maybe that's why she didn't comment.
That place is out of control.
:evil:
I didn’t like how a respectful sister was treated like a punching bag by everyone even certain mods because she had a difference of an opinion but a wise opinion/judgment from the Islamic perceptive
Equality would have been to ask her to reply. AND not for the self appointed Mpac vanguards to gloat at her
And help me out with this so i'm just sure i'm not living in a parallel reality - She went to a public school and was told she couldn't wear a Jilbab because it was "religious dress" and violated the uniform policy?
Now Dust and Rose (welcome to the forum btw! Love Texas - great state) you both live or have lived in the United States and you are aware of our laws regarding discrimination.
Wouldn't the state's objections be considered moot here? I mean like Rose I have nooo idea how old you are or if you are even a girl but if you wanted to wear a jilbab to school - barring idiotic teachers, stares and ignorant people would there be any legal problem with that?
And our First Amendment is directly derived from the rights of englishmen supposedly enforced by the Courts of Britain... so where is the school's objection... how can they do this!?
Will all due respect Don, if you read this thread from the beginning, then the you'll find answer to your question.
We have a sister from Texas?
I mod a whole forum with Americans lol
Yea she was pretty much tried and sentanced before she even stepped into Court. The mods really need to get their acts together and the whole forum is falling apart. The Christians are infuriated and want to leave, there are about 5 or 6 members put off by mod abuse, and generally speaking there is incredible factionalization.
I think that's pretty apparent if you look at the number of MPACers joining the Revival whenever they are linked.
Thing is I am getting conflicting opinions on why that kind of dress was banned... Yashmakis article seems to indicate it had to do with promoting "good islam" against "bad islam" which is an incredible tampering with religion if that's the case.
And yes - the new member Rose is from Texas, Ahmed is another poster from the US - Seattle and Dust is from the United States.
So basically it's the four of us... surrounded by all you crazy brits.
And your "fish and chips"
One reason was it was against school uniform polices and “health and safely” - I dont agree with ....
I resent that last comment about “Fish N chips”
My old R.E teacher said that in the olden days Fish and Chips use to cost 10p now is cost close to five pounds, that’s because of the shortage of cod – curse those EU regulations :?
but in the States, public schools generally dont implement school uniforms, students can wear whatever they want so its not much of an issue anyway. but this school said that the jilbab went against their 'uniform policy'.
[size=9]I NEVER WORE IT BECAUSE OF THE TALIBAN, MOTHER. I LIKE THE [b]MODESTY[/b] AND [b]PROTECTION[/b] IT AFFORDS ME FROM THE EYES OF MEN.[/size] [url=http://www.adherents.com/lit/comics/Dust.html]Dust, X-Men[/url]
Dust if I may ask you this question, what matters more the right to pray or the right to defend that right?
the right to pray - if you have that then you dont need to go through the process of defending it in the first place.
[size=9]I NEVER WORE IT BECAUSE OF THE TALIBAN, MOTHER. I LIKE THE [b]MODESTY[/b] AND [b]PROTECTION[/b] IT AFFORDS ME FROM THE EYES OF MEN.[/size] [url=http://www.adherents.com/lit/comics/Dust.html]Dust, X-Men[/url]
indeed
[size=9]I NEVER WORE IT BECAUSE OF THE TALIBAN, MOTHER. I LIKE THE [b]MODESTY[/b] AND [b]PROTECTION[/b] IT AFFORDS ME FROM THE EYES OF MEN.[/size] [url=http://www.adherents.com/lit/comics/Dust.html]Dust, X-Men[/url]
erm i wear the jilbab and i don't consider myself an extremist.
The girls and guys who said it's more than adequate to wear a salwar kameez or long skirt. Well you deem it adequate coz it suits your ideas of modesty. Had it not suited your ideas of modesty you wouldn't be singing the same tune. Stop being subjective. You can't expect everyone to live by your own standards. In the same way each sister has a different idea of modesty.
When i started out a long skirt and top was enough for me. But as i progressed, did more reading i decided i would be more comftable in a jilbab. that doesn't mean i've turned into an extremist just because i know longer wear a skirt of salwar kameez, could you possibly be more insulting.
The fuss is being made by no one but the media, and sad to say this but certain muslims appear to be ashamed to accept the jilbab as an article of muslim dress regardless of whether it's obligatory or not. So they tend to support the media not coz they actually agree with them, but just to distance themselves from these so called "extreme" muslims.
think u've hit the nail right on the head sis.
its quite sad, when Muslim's are afraid of the media and ashamed of fellow muslims, when clearly there is no need to.
its the mindset that thats been passed down from our parents and grandparents who first migrated to the west, that we're in a 'foreign' country therefore we should accept 'their' culture 'and not make a fuss'.. it was acceptable then as they we're 'guests', but the 3rd, 4th generation saying the same sorta things in fear of being sent 'back home'.. thats tragic.
taking that mentality in my opinion distances the cultures rather than bridging them.
its about time Muslim started thinking of this land as their own, as their home.
[b][i]Round and round the Ka'bah,
Like a good Sahabah,
One step, Two step,
All the way to jannah[/i][/b]
i wouldnt agree with u there at all...
who said wearinh jilbaab is extremist...
its about school uniform, school didnt accept it, they have a right not to....
uniform is uniform
cant let one muslim wear jilbaab an drest have to stick to uniform
then rastafarians, punks, hippies, nudists, girls who just wanna wear short skirts and just revealing tight clothes..... where do you draw the line?
this is where muslims fail to understand... thinking from a neutral point of view... a rule, uniform or policy is there for a reason...if u dont like that rule, policy, uniform...then dont go that school- there are others schools who might cater for you!!!
others schools that do allow jilbaab couldnt she have joined them?
couldnt she have joined islamic school?
there are always alternatives...
i dont think u or shabina are extremists...i personally think she was misadviced in her action...
and just because u disagree with a Muslim it doesnt mean u are brainwashed by the media... like some ppl here always state!
its not just media who were fussing over this issue, bnp, islamophobes, a group of anti-muslim writers have united to speak against this, journalists , think tanks, politicians, and basically the ordinary non-Muslim believe 'Muslims think this is islamic country...if you dont like it here then go somewhere islamic....' and this where BNP get their support and sympathy....
don't think people should be driven out of their homes and go somewhere 'islamic' just because fascists say so. its these sorta fascist ideologies that Muslims must defeat. I believe the sister is doing just that.
She's not breaking any laws, imo she's done it in the most civil way possible.
also dont think its fair comparing a someone who wears a Jilbab to nudists, and those who wish to expose themselves.
School uniform.. fair do's, they got a policy. Back to square one..
Shabina disagreed with those policies, so she took it to court. As is 'her right' to do in 'her country'.
Fascists have a problem because they see Islam as a threat to Allah knows what?.., and have made a big song and dance out of something perfectly Legal.
and now we have a sect of Muslims arising that have a problem because the Fascists have a problem??
thats a defeatist attitude in my opinion. I'm sorry in my opinion that aint Islam.. if it were the world would never have heard of it.
[b][i]Round and round the Ka'bah,
Like a good Sahabah,
One step, Two step,
All the way to jannah[/i][/b]
I agree girls who wana wear jilbab or have other Islamic needs that a state school can't provide should ideally go to a faith school or a state school which will see to these needs.
But at the same time it's her democratic right to make a case against the school. She went through the right channels. she didn't organise violent marches portraying our faith in a bad way. I don't think there's anything wrong in seeing if you can make a "change" what have you got to lose exactly? If you never ask or challenge the system you'll never gain anything.
I've not spoken to her. But from what i've read her situation was different she started out happy with the school uniform, but i guess as she started delving into her faith she felt the jilbab was more appropriate for her. Since she'd approached her exam period i don't suppose it was the best time for her to be considering a different school. How many schools admit you at the end of a term or year anyway?
I duno if i would have had the courage to go through all she has at such a young age. so i give her credit where it's due, and i'm sure God will reward her for her efforts.
It's issues like these that have made me wonder do i really wana send my child to a state school. There's so many pros and cons, in each school system.
shocking words...
what can i say bro...u wont understand what im trying to say...
sr yashmakis comments have more sense..even though i would disagree somewhat... but thats beauty of Islam, we can disagree.... and not be called a sect, defeatist or brainwashed!!!!
brainwashed..? if u say so.
so u accept that u got a problem with shabina's case, cos fascists have a problem in this instance?
sorry if I don't understand.. but that how it came across in ur last post.
[b][i]Round and round the Ka'bah,
Like a good Sahabah,
One step, Two step,
All the way to jannah[/i][/b]
u wikll never understand!
because i disagree with u and shabina, then i must be a bnp suppporter.... absolutely ridiculous...
of course i got a problem with shabinas case...have u not read any of the posts i have wrote man! i said her decision was misadviced....and blah blah ...read before u accuse.
try harder to explain then. :evil:
and IMO khan has spotted a valid flaw in your argument. what others will think is NEVER an acceptable excuse in a matter between a person and his/her creator.
You have a valid argument about bad advice... but that is about it really.
It should have been dealt with diferently, and with the courtcase result, it leaves a bad precedent.
But I support her fight for her right to try to practice Islam to the best of her abilities as they are understood by her and some others.
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
no surprise admin u disagree with me.... but thats how its always been
its not just what others think admin.... u also miss the point... for crying out loud.
like banging ur head against the wall sometimes on this forum...
ok can you, mr know it all, tell us all what this very important point is that we all seem to be missing?
Just phrase it lightly for our simple minds.
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
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