Koran and Country - Radio 4

[size=18]How Islam Got Political[/size]
[size=14]An Analysis Special[/size]

[b]Radio 4

Thursday, 10 November

20:00 GMT[/b]

Frank Gardner, the BBC's Security Correspondent, traces the rise of political Islam in Britain and around the world.

From the political Islamic movement founded in colonial India by Syed Abul Ala Mawdudi to the Muslim Brotherhood and al Qaeda, this special edition of Analysis traces the history of mainstream and radical political Islam.

[url=

So, did anyone listen to it? No?... OK. I'll summarise.

FTF Irfan Chisti was one of the contributors. He spoke of his opposition to the concept of takfir (excommunication) and his aprehension about Mawdudi influence in British Muslim political movements.

The main points (international)
- Abd ala Mawdudi was Indian journalist who failed to complete Islamic training. He wrote about Islam as ideology capable of taking on the West and throwing off colonialism. '20th century godfather of political Islam.'
- Syrian Syed Qutb was member of Egyptian Muslim Brotherhood. Qutb read Mawdudi's books. Qutb became more radical due to torture under President Nasser.
- Qutb embraced takfir. And went around calling other Muslims kaffirs.
- Saudis opposed Nasser. So they funded and backed political Islamist radicals (inc. Muslim Brotherhood) so that they could undermine Nasser.
- In late 1980s Afghanistan a rift emerged between Abdul Azzam and his 'student' ObL. Azzam non-violent. Azzam was undermined and then assassinated.
- Bosnia, 9-11, etc

The main points (Britain)
- The Iranian Revolution politicised British Sunni Muslims. Iranian Revolution was nopt seen as 'Shia' but 'Islamic'.
- Islamic Foundation links with Revolutionary Iran.
- Asghar Bukhari spraypainted library that stocked Satanic Verses. Lol
- Kalim Siddiquie wanted British Muslims to be isolationist. Set up Muslim Parliament.
- HT and Omar Bakri told British Muslims to help Bosnians politically, discouraged going to and fighting in Bosnia.
- Muslim Parliament led to MCB.
- MCB set up links with New Labour pre-1997.
- MP, MCB, MAB influenced by Mawdudi.
- 1990s emergence of videotapes of Muslim suffering in Bosnia, Chechnya, Algeria circulate among Muslim community.
- MPAC not influenced by Mawdudi but TV pictures of Muslim suffering.

Conclusion
- Majority of British Muslims don't want confrontation with West, they don't want strict Islamic gov.

2 points bruv. Mawdudi was called Abu'l Ala Mawdudi not Abd ala Mawdudi.

Mawdudi was NOT a mawlana by any stretch of the word.

and second point is it was Shaykh Abdullah Azzam, not Abdul Azzam

Ya ALLAH Madad.
Haq Chaar Yaar

"Med" wrote:
2 points bruv. Mawdudi was called Abu'l Ala Mawdudi not Abd ala Mawdudi.

Mawdudi was NOT a mawlana by any stretch of the word.

and second point is it was Shaykh Abdullah Azzam, not Abdul Azzam

Thankyouuu Med.

I couldn't be bothered to check again to make sure. I thought anyone who knew would kindly dismiss it as a spelling mistake.

Wink

"irfghan" wrote:
"Med" wrote:
2 points bruv. Mawdudi was called Abu'l Ala Mawdudi not Abd ala Mawdudi.

Mawdudi was NOT a mawlana by any stretch of the word.

and second point is it was Shaykh Abdullah Azzam, not Abdul Azzam

Thankyouuu Med.

I couldn't be bothered to check again to make sure. I thought anyone who knew would kindly dismiss it as a spelling mistake.

Wink

lol sorry.

Ya ALLAH Madad.
Haq Chaar Yaar

Salam

I heard the radio program.

It is useless, as it was inaccurate.

BBC standards seem to be declining.

Omrow

what training? that doesnt mean he's not a scholar. :?

thanx for the link. i wil listen to it sometime this weekend inshaAllah.

[size=9]I NEVER WORE IT BECAUSE OF THE TALIBAN, MOTHER. I LIKE THE [b]MODESTY[/b] AND [b]PROTECTION[/b] IT AFFORDS ME FROM THE EYES OF MEN.[/size] [url=, X-Men[/url]

Mawdudi was NOT scholar by ANY stretch of the word. He was a journalist who wrote prolifically, sometimes without knowing what it was that he wrote.

Ya ALLAH Madad.
Haq Chaar Yaar

"Med" wrote:
Mawdudi was NOT scholar by ANY stretch of the word.

according to whom?

[size=9]I NEVER WORE IT BECAUSE OF THE TALIBAN, MOTHER. I LIKE THE [b]MODESTY[/b] AND [b]PROTECTION[/b] IT AFFORDS ME FROM THE EYES OF MEN.[/size] [url=, X-Men[/url]

lol, according to me, thats who!

hahahaha

but seriously he has no scholarly tradition to back him up, he has no connection with Ulama, was an independent free thinker who brought into existence a calamity.

Ya ALLAH Madad.
Haq Chaar Yaar

"Med" wrote:
lol, according to me, thats who!

hahahaha

but seriously he has no scholarly tradition to back him up, he has no connection with Ulama, was an independent free thinker who brought into existence a calamity.


not funny. :? do u realise the gravity of ur claim? ur not a scholar urself (as far as i'm aware) so how can u say this with such confidence?

wot calamity?

[size=9]I NEVER WORE IT BECAUSE OF THE TALIBAN, MOTHER. I LIKE THE [b]MODESTY[/b] AND [b]PROTECTION[/b] IT AFFORDS ME FROM THE EYES OF MEN.[/size] [url=, X-Men[/url]

k, i dont want to be accused of sectarian strife, so will suffice to say that I dont think he is an alim. And I believe his comments abt my Master, Sayyidina Musa alayhis salaam, about my Master Sayyidina Dawud alayhis salaam, and also about other Ambiya alayhim us salaatu was salaam were a great calamity and trial and tribulation upon the masses.

Also his arrogance in regards to my Master, Sayyidina Uthman radhiyallahu anhu, my master Ameer Muawiya radhiyallahu anhu and other Sahabah Karaam alayhim ridhwaan was work not befitting any muslim, let alone a 'scholar'.

If u like him, then u may do so. I dont think he is an alim. Bas.

Ya ALLAH Madad.
Haq Chaar Yaar

"Med" wrote:
k, i dont want to be accused of sectarian strife, so will suffice to say that I dont think he is an alim. And I believe his comments abt my Master, Sayyidina Musa alayhis salaam, about my Master Sayyidina Dawud alayhis salaam, and also about other Ambiya alayhim us salaatu was salaam were a great calamity and trial and tribulation upon the masses.

Also his arrogance in regards to my Master, Sayyidina Uthman radhiyallahu anhu, my master Ameer Muawiya radhiyallahu anhu and other Sahabah Karaam alayhim ridhwaan was work not befitting any muslim, let alone a 'scholar'.

If u like him, then u may do so. I dont think he is an alim. Bas.


i wasnt about to accuse u of anything. and btw i dont have any particular preference for Mawdudi's works.

plz can u quote these comments of his?

[size=9]I NEVER WORE IT BECAUSE OF THE TALIBAN, MOTHER. I LIKE THE [b]MODESTY[/b] AND [b]PROTECTION[/b] IT AFFORDS ME FROM THE EYES OF MEN.[/size] [url=, X-Men[/url]

I will have to do mutala'a of relevant books, this may take a few days.

Ya ALLAH Madad.
Haq Chaar Yaar

"Med" wrote:
I will have to do mutala'a of relevant books, this may take a few days.

no prob.

[size=9]I NEVER WORE IT BECAUSE OF THE TALIBAN, MOTHER. I LIKE THE [b]MODESTY[/b] AND [b]PROTECTION[/b] IT AFFORDS ME FROM THE EYES OF MEN.[/size] [url=, X-Men[/url]

Quote:
Listen, Maududi Saheb says that:

1. The example of Moosa Alaihis salaam is of that hasty victorious commander, who marches forward without strengthening and estabil- ishing his authority, and behind him mutiny spreads in the conquered lands like wild fire in a jungle. Maududi Mazhab, page 23.

2. The danger of the highway robbery of a mischievous soul also con- fronts the Ambiyaa. An illustrious Prophet like Dawood Alaihis salaam. was werned on an occasion that."............and follow not desire that beguile thee from the way of Allah'. Surah Saad: 27 Ibid page 21

3. Dawood Alaihis salaam became influenced with the customs of the Israeli society of his time and requested Orya to give a divorce. Ibid page 24

4. Dawood Alaihis salam had a speck of carnal desire in his deeds. Ibid Page 25

5. Human weaknesses overcame Nuh Alaihis salaam snd he became a prey to the passion of Jahiliyyah. Ibid page 26.

6. Actually Ismat (chastity) is not a requisite with the soul of the Ambiyaa. This is a Lateef (delicate) point. Allah Ta'aala had intentionally lifted His protection at some time or the other from every Nabi, so that one or two trangressions are committed, hence the people may not regard the Ambiyaa as Gods, and will know that these are human too. Ibid page 30.

7. The Ambiyaa trangress too, they are even punished. Ibid page 31.

8. Younus Alaihis salaem committed a few deficiencies in the fulfilling of the Faraa'id of Risalat, and probably became Impatient and left his position before time. Ibid page 35.

9. The Sahaabah were at times overcome with human shortcomings; they reviled one another (read the balance of this paragraph on page 56. I am ashamed of copying it further).

10. The Sahaabah Kiraam many a time erred in understanding the original spirit of Jihaad fi Sabilillah. Ibid page 59.

11. Once a humble person like (Abubakr) Siddique Akbar who was immersed in Lillahiyyat (the way of Allah) erred (blundered) in fulfilling a delicate demand of islam.

12. Personal greatness overcame and made Umar Radhiallahu Anhu helpless for a few moments at the time of the demise of Rasulullah Sal- lallahu alaihi wa Sallam. Ibid page 60.

13, Hazrat Uthman, on whom the burden of this great duty (of Khilafat) was placed, did not possess the qualifications that were granted to his noble predecessors. Therefore, Jahiliyyah found an inlet to creep into the social code of Islam. Ibid page 65.

14. The verdicts of the Khulafaa Raashideen, which they issued as Qadis, did not become law in Islam. Ibid page 66.

15. Hadhrat Uthman, one after the other, appointed tiis relatives to high posts, and gave them other such concessions, which generally became a source of criticism among the people. Ibid page 71.

16. For example he bequeathed on Marwan one fifth (5 lakh Dinars) from the booty of Africa. Ibid page 71.

17. History reveals, and it truly shows, that Marwan and Yazeed are despised personalities among the Muslim Ummah. These are the softest words that could be said regarding Marwan and Yazeed. Faraan monthly September 1976, page 42.

18. These policies of Uthman Radhiallahu Anhu are without doubt, erroneous. A wrong will remain a wrong, irrespective of who commits it. To try and prove it correct by oratory or fabrications is not the demand of logic and justice, nor is it the requirement of the Deen, that an error of a Sahaabi should not be called an error. Maududi Mazhab, page 73.

19. One very despicable Bid'ah began during the reign of Hadhrat Mu'aawiyah, that he himself, and by his orders, all his governors, while delivering Khutbas on the minbars reviled Hadhrat Ali Radhiallahu Anhu. To revile and swear a person after his demise, forget the Shari'ah, it was against human etiquette to do so, and especially to soil the Jum'ah Khutbah with such filth is a very debased act according to the Deen and etiquette. Ibid page 75.

20. The effort of joining together (Istilhaaq) Ziyaad bin Simayyah are also among those acts of Hadhrat Mu'aawiyah Radhiallahu Anhu, wherein because of political reasons he contravened an accepted law of the Shari'ah. Ibid page 76.

21. Hadhrat Mu'aawiyah Radhiallahu Anhu in trying to make him (Ziyaad) his supporter and helper took evidence on the adultery of his father (Abu Sufyaan). And after concluding proof therof, made Ziyaad his (Abu Sufyaan's) illegitimate son, and on that source made him his brother and a member of the family, This and in whatever manner it may be despised morally, is evident. But according to law --- this is an illicit thing, because in the Shari'ah paternity is not proven from adultery. ibid page 77.

22. Amr bin Al'aas committed two such acts, that there is no way out but to call if wrong. Ibid page 84.

23. Hadhrat Ali appointed Malik bin Haarith and Muhammad bin Abu- bakr as governors, whereas, these two people had a hand in the murder of Unman. This is known to everybody. During the entire reign of Ali Radhiallahu Anhu this is the only deed that it seems, cannot be called anything else but wrong. Ibid page 85.

24. Hadhrat Aysha Radhiallahu Anha and Hafsah Radhiallahu Anha became bold, and began to 'stretch their tongues' in the presence of Rasulullah Sallallahu alaihi wa Sallam. Ibid page 88.

25. After studying History it is found that until now, no thorough Mujaddid was Dorn. It was near that Umar bin Abdulaziz attained that position, but he was not successful. Ibid page 91.

26. In the reviews of Immam Ghazali, there are a few llmi and Fikri flaws, and that may be distributed into three portions, One type is those flaws, that resulted in his works due to the poor knowledge of Hadith, The second type from among those flaws is due to the Aqliyyah overpowering his mind. And the third type from among these flaws is his leening towards Tasawwuf more than that which was necessary. Ibid page 92.

27. The first thing that rattles in me regarding the revival mission from the time of Hazrat Mujaddid Alf Thaani to the time of Shah (Waliyullah) Saheb and his disciples, in this, thar, in Tasawwuf they did not estimate the illness of the Muslims. They prescribed for them the same food from which they should have been completely kept away. Ibid page 92.

28. Neither Hadhrat Mujaddid Seheb nor Shah (Waliyullah) Saheb was unaware of this 'Illness'. Criticism regarding this is found in the writings of both. It is possible that they did not truly estimate the serious- ness of this 'disease'. For this reason these two venerable personalities gave these sick people the same food, which had proven to be fatal. The outcome of this was that gradually, both circles became influenced by the same disease. Ibid page 94.

29. Although Maulana Ismail Shaheed R. Alayhi understood this reality well and adopted the same course as that of Ibn Taymiyyah, but, as this was present in the literature of Shah Waliyullah Saber, the effects of which remained in the writings of Shah (smail Shaheed R. Alayhi, tlute chain of Peer/ Mureedi continued in the movement of Sayyid Saheb Therefore, this movement could not be free from the germs of the 'dis- ease of sufiyyat.' Ibid page 95.

30. And we note this 'Jahalah' - with the exception of a very small Jamaat - among the general Muslims from East to West, be they from il- literate pvblic; or graduate Ulama; or mendicant Mashaa'ikh; or grad- uates of colleges or universities. The thoughts, ways and manners of all these are different, but they are unanimous in not knowing the truth and soul of Islam. Ibid page 19.

that will do for time being

Ya ALLAH Madad.
Haq Chaar Yaar

"Med" wrote:
Mawdudi was NOT scholar by ANY stretch of the word. He was a journalist who wrote prolifically, sometimes without knowing what it was that he wrote.

true and double true in my humble opinion

hmmmmmmm....got mawdudis tafseer of the quran at home, still in corner...i guess no point in lookin at it if its fabricated.

mawdudi was totally unqualified to do a tafseer of Quran.

Ya ALLAH Madad.
Haq Chaar Yaar

yea....well its rite coz it waz gifted to my bro from the mosque he did trawihs at....SO i guess they'll stay in corner not as though we bought em innit.

might just hav a look though.

erm... I did say no sectarian posts...

I do not care wether he was a scholar or not. He may have been a great man. or he may not.

Whatever he said, I would listen to, compare with other scholars and my heart, and make my own judgement.

Sorry, but I have to tow the line as I said I would.

Noone has anything to gain or lose.

No sectarian issues. End of debate.

"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.

No-one has mentioned anything sectarian.

On the Radio 4 programme it was [b]Revival scholar Irfan Chisti[/b] who said he didn't like Mawdudi influence in this country.

"irfghan" wrote:

On the Radio 4 programme it was [b]Revival scholar Irfan Chisti[/b] who said he didn't like Mawdudi influence in this country.

oh? Fool

and yeh admin, no1s sed anything sectarian here. :?

[size=9]I NEVER WORE IT BECAUSE OF THE TALIBAN, MOTHER. I LIKE THE [b]MODESTY[/b] AND [b]PROTECTION[/b] IT AFFORDS ME FROM THE EYES OF MEN.[/size] [url=, X-Men[/url]

What is it with the BBC and Abu Khadijah?

I remember in some talk him condemning Ahl-Hadeeth (spl?) for meeting with a labour mp. Saudi Salafis also condemn HT for talking to the media. Apparently the BBC are an exception.

He's been on two shows now.

Although I have to say what he said made a lot of sense.

He is not [b]Revival Scholar Irfan Chisti[/b]

He is someone we run our articles through... one of many scholars. He has helped us alot, But I doubt he would like to be pidgeonholed as a revival scholar...

Secondly, the sectarian bit was:

he is not a scholar. He has no right to call himself a scholar. he is wrong. etc... he should not have done a tafsir of the qur'an.

He shouldor should not have done that. I do not care either way. But criticising him jus for th sake of it is not good. If someone has not done full Dars Nizami (as he may not have... I do not know) it does not mean the person does not have any knowledge or understanding...

Now if there are any hardcore supporters of him who visit here, they will feel compelled to bak their guy up. Now where is the diference from previous arguments?

In one way it would be even worse, as his followers are not just followers, but his muqallid...

"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.

"Admin" wrote:
He is not [b]Revival Scholar Irfan Chisti[/b]

He is someone we run our articles through... one of many scholars. He has helped us alot, But I doubt he would like to be pidgeonholed as a revival scholar...

Yeah, but you know what I meant. Wink

"Admin" wrote:

Secondly, the sectarian bit was:

he is not a scholar. He has no right to call himself a scholar. he is wrong. etc... he should not have done a tafsir of the qur'an.

He shouldor should not have done that. I do not care either way. But criticising him jus for th sake of it is not good. If someone has not done full Dars Nizami (as he may not have... I do not know) it does not mean the person does not have any knowledge or understanding...


i agree with all those points admin, but i stil dont c how it contributes to sectarianism as mawdudi doesnt have his own 'sect' as such right? tho yeh, fair enuf, he does hav a loada supporters (esp. among arabs, interestingly!).

so Med, i got in touch with a Deobandi scholar about this, and here's wot he basically sed:
'we do not call Mawdudi a 'scholar' as he did not go through an instituiton such as Darul Uloom. However, he did study privately with various scholars and may well have gained ijazah through them. All humans make mistakes, so although we do not agree with Mawdudi on some points, it would be foolish to disregard his works altogether.' Incidentally, this deobandi scholar also mentioned that Mawdudi has a great book on ur favourite subject Med: Purdah! Smile

[size=9]I NEVER WORE IT BECAUSE OF THE TALIBAN, MOTHER. I LIKE THE [b]MODESTY[/b] AND [b]PROTECTION[/b] IT AFFORDS ME FROM THE EYES OF MEN.[/size] [url=, X-Men[/url]

Yes I acknowledge that some of his books were written well, but overall his wrong comments outweight his good ones.

Ya ALLAH Madad.
Haq Chaar Yaar

"Med" wrote:
Yes I acknowledge that some of his books were written well, but overall his wrong comments outweight his good ones.

jazakallah khair for acknowledging that! so would u not then agree that as Muslims we should judge others by their good points first and foremost?

[size=9]I NEVER WORE IT BECAUSE OF THE TALIBAN, MOTHER. I LIKE THE [b]MODESTY[/b] AND [b]PROTECTION[/b] IT AFFORDS ME FROM THE EYES OF MEN.[/size] [url=, X-Men[/url]

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