Salaams,
I have just done some light online reading and a few things I have read do not sit well by me, so just asking for explanations, etc from proper sources instead of random internet essays.
Specifically more about these two paragraphs from here (a shia article quoting sunni sources):
Also refer to the esteemed Sunni historian Abul Hasan, Ali Ibn al-Husain al-Mas'udi who in his book 'Isbaat al-Wasiyyah' describes the events in detail and reports that: "They surrounded Ali (AS) and burned the door of his house and pulled him out against his will and pressed the leader of all women (Hadhrat Fatimah (AS)) between the door and the wall killing Mohsin (the male-child she was carrying in her womb for six months)."
Salahuddin Khalil al-Safadi another Sunni scholar in his book 'Waafi al-Wafiyyaat' under the letter 'A' while recording the view of Ibrahim Ibn Sayyar Ibn Hani al-Basri, well-known as Nidhaam quotes him to have said:
"On the day of 'Bay'aat' (paying allegiance), Umar hit Fatimah (AS) on the stomach such that child in her womb died."
So how accurate is this? I am not looking for the "why it was done" because that is covered later (to keep the people united under one leadership etc etc etc - but if people want to discuss that, go ahead.), but rather that this is the first time I have read that Hadhrat Fatima Zahra (ra) was carrying and lost her child (which had already been named Mohsin?) at this time.
Why have I never come across this before?
(I am not looking for the assignment of blame or any such thing, just if the above is true and if I am alone in not knowing it, with maybe some exposition by those in the know/access to teachers who can shed some light.)
I don;t know if it's true, so you'll have to ask someone who knows about the history. But what I will say is killing a baby is like murder, which is totally out of the character of Umar bin Khattab.
“Before death takes away what you are given, give away whatever there is to give.”
Mawlana Jalal ud Din Rumi
I think it was an accident.
But my shia friends are quite adament that Umar
meant to kill Fatima just as he once meant to kill the Prophet.
Obviously the shias dont like the first three righteous caliphs every much, accusing them of many unsavory things such as this episode.
I tell them, look, if Umar wanted to kill anyone, trust me, they could not escape.
He just banged on the door a bit too hard, and the
door being weak, fell on her, and it was all simply an accident. Get over it.
Ofcourse, history books give different versions of events
depending on who wrote them and with what type of biases.
Good point.
Gentleness and kindness were never a part of anything except that it made it beautiful, and harshness was never a part of anything except that it made it ugly.
Through cheating, stealing, and lying, one may get required results but finally one becomes
I was not arguing about intent - I was just surprised at never having read that before. Was it just because I never looked into things, or is this something that is not always mentioned?
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
Salam
We cant answer the first part for you. You would have to do that kind thing yourself.
As to the second bit, I too did not know about it until my mates told me.
There seem to be many things in history that are kept
hidden from the lay people out of fear of startling them.
Somethings are brushed under the carpet.
Whitewash happens everywhere, not just at the White House.
Omrow
IMO hiding information is pointless and can e counter productive - it will reduce the number of reports etc to those who have a bias in the matter, leaving objective parties out in the cold.
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
From elsewhere I have read:
So the chances are that what was quoted was not even from a "sunni" source.
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
random curiosity. I think its good to know what happened. apart from that, its not an article of faith or anything.
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
No but if it isn't true, and someone accuses Umar bin Khattab of something like this then surely we have a duty to defend him?
“Before death takes away what you are given, give away whatever there is to give.”
Mawlana Jalal ud Din Rumi