World cup Haraaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaam!!

Salaam as you are all im sure its world cup time and everyones going football mad or nearly everybody but i recieved a leaflet today from a al-muhajiroun about how the world cup is haraam, this got me thinking is it really haraam? should we be watching football and engaging in the England campaign for world glory or is this some more ranting from nutters who learnt how to printer?

What was the argument presented?

"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.

MuslimBro wrote:
Would have been nice to see the actual article.

Wasnt an article an a5 piece paper about nationalism and etc

Those who danced were thought to be quite insane, by those who couldn't hear the music...

You wrote:
What was the argument presented?

Tbh the argument wasnt important just that it prompted me to think about it and wanted the views of you guys do you think its okay or do you have any reasons why we shouldnt watch it support England etc?

Those who danced were thought to be quite insane, by those who couldn't hear the music...

im no scholar better to ask one. But i dont think there's anything haram about the sport in general, its more so the things associated with it.

The mania, how the fans go nuts, and give allegiance to their team and country. makes me wonder how muslims can forget what this government has done to the muslims in iraq for example.

, the violence they are willing to carry out if their team loses.

the enemies they're willing to make with friends and family if they do not support the same team

the hundreds of pounds they're willing to spend to see their fave team play.

the amount of time spent watching these matches.

The sponsors of the event and memorabilia i/e alcohol companies, buying and wearing them we are promoting sin.

Football has often been described as a religion for many of it's followers. They are willing to miss their wedding day to watch a match, or the birth of their child. to put their wives and children second to the game. No amount of reasoning works with these fanatics.

i don't know what al muhajiroon have said and i don't take from them either.

I'm not saying don't watch the worldcup, but keep it in perspective. if your mother is asking you to carry out a task for her, don't disobey her. if salat time arrives, record it dont delay. basically saying always make sure your deeni obligations are not neglected in favour of this sport or any sport, maintain the middle ground always.

“O my people! Truly, this life of the world is nothing but a (quick passing) enjoyment, and verily, the hereafter that is the home that will remain forever.” [Ghafir : 39]

Rule no 1- al muhajiroun are a bunch of crackpots and most people will back me up on this.... these were the guys after 9/11 held a conference called the magnificent 19- after the 19 suicide bombers who flew the planes in twin towers. now if that isnt distateful and damaging to Islam/Muslims then i dont know what to say....

now re: this issue

watching football, supporting a FOOTBALL team is just fun, enjoyable....
i'll be supporting England... plus my other teams i admire are brazil, argentina, portugal, spain. If England dont win the cup i want Portugal to do it

now to say this is nationalism is just crackpots who dont know anything about anything!
having an affiliation or supporting your country's football team shouldnt be seen as anything more than mere sporty, footy mad etc

ive been to world cup cricket matches, holding paksitan flag, shouting Pakistan Zindabaad- anything wrong with that - is it heck. supporting your countrys cricket team doesnt make you put your country before your deen; any pakistani cricket mad fan will know his affiliation to Islam comes before any nations team.

Nowadays al muhajiroun/HT have scared and confused ppl so much on issue of nationalism its crazy!

Nationalism is when your country, its cultures, laws, leadership ets is seen as superior than Islam or you have more love for your nation that Islam or you are paksitani/british first then Muslim then all this would be nationalsim (assabiyah) and then it would apply to the hadith that such people will be sent to teh lowest form of jahannam.

 

Hajjar wrote:
im no scholar better to ask one. But i dont think there's anything haram about the sport in general, its more so the things associated with it.

The mania, how the fans go nuts, and give allegiance to their team and country. makes me wonder how muslims can forget what this government has done to the muslims in iraq for example.

, the violence they are willing to carry out if their team loses.

the enemies they're willing to make with friends and family if they do not support the same team

the hundreds of pounds they're willing to spend to see their fave team play.

the amount of time spent watching these matches.

The sponsors of the event and memorabilia i/e alcohol companies, buying and wearing them we are promoting sin.

Football has often been described as a religion for many of it's followers. They are willing to miss their wedding day to watch a match, or the birth of their child. to put their wives and children second to the game. No amount of reasoning works with these fanatics.

i don't know what al muhajiroon have said and i don't take from them either.

I'm not saying don't watch the worldcup, but keep it in perspective. if your mother is asking you to carry out a task for her, don't disobey her. if salat time arrives, record it dont delay. basically saying always make sure your deeni obligations are not neglected in favour of this sport or any sport, maintain the middle ground always.

+1
everything in moderation.

the thing is... football shorts do not cover the awrah of the players therefore....

Is it true? Is it kind? Is it necessary?

Are men not allowed to wear shorts?

Why does England always have non-English managers??!

 

guys awrah goes from their belly button to below their knees. so no short except at homes/ in front of Mahraams

South Korea!! 2-nil against Greece

Is it true? Is it kind? Is it necessary?

muslim men can wear shorts they just have to buy ones slightly longer that cover the knees, no big deal. Sorry brothers you can't show off your knobbly knees!

“O my people! Truly, this life of the world is nothing but a (quick passing) enjoyment, and verily, the hereafter that is the home that will remain forever.” [Ghafir : 39]

Funzo wrote:
...or is this some more ranting from nutters who learnt how to printer?

No doubt they would cite your own words against you and state in similar terms: is this a rant from a nutter who can't even string a sentence together? Smile

Trackie bottoms is where it is at.

"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.

Funzo wrote:
...or is this some more ranting from nutters who learnt how to printer?

No doubt they would cite your own words against you and state in similar terms: is this a rant from a nutter who can't even string a sentence together? Smile

Hajjar wrote:
muslim men can wear shorts they just have to buy ones slightly longer that cover the knees, no big deal. Sorry brothers you can't show off your knobbly knees!

Depends on your school of thought - some schools permit thighs to be shown so there would be no issue!

Anonymous1 wrote:
Funzo wrote:
...or is this some more ranting from nutters who learnt how to printer?

No doubt they would cite your own words against you and state in similar terms: is this a rant from a nutter who can't even string a sentence together? Smile

there is a thing call "typo"

Hajjar wrote:

muslim men can wear shorts they just have to buy ones slightly longer that cover the knees, no big deal. Sorry brothers you can't show off your knobbly knees!

Depends on your school of thought - some schools permit thighs to be shown so there would be no issue!

thighs??? wouaw...i thought someone would argue with me about the "below/above the knee" but thighs?? and what sort of Muslim would want to show off their thighs?

Is it true? Is it kind? Is it necessary?

TheRevivalEditor wrote:
Rule no 1- al muhajiroun are a bunch of crackpots and most people will back me up on this....

So it's ok to insult those you disagree with but you don't like it when others "insult" you - hmmmmm looks like a double standard... one should at least try to be consistent Smile

And it's interesting you need the majority to tell you ALM are "crackpots" - most Muslims have not even heard of them or of you!

TheRevivalEditor wrote:
these were the guys after 9/11 held a conference called the magnificent 19- after the 19 suicide bombers who flew the planes in twin towers. now if that isnt distateful and damaging to Islam/Muslims then i dont know what to say....

You obviously didn't see the videos reporters picked up of Muslim pleasure around the world that the US got what it's been doling out for years... hmmmmm or is this just a little bit of selectivism for people you hate?

TheRevivalEditor wrote:
watching football, supporting a FOOTBALL team is just fun, enjoyable....

Of course it is - staring at non-Muslim men with naked thighs kicking a ball around - whilst Muslims around the world are being oppressed, Islam is being villified... let's encurage all Muslims to just watch football - it's fun - isn't that the purpose of our lives? Smile

TheRevivalEditor wrote:
i'll be supporting England...

Now why does that not surprise me? Given you are a BritishHinduMuslim no doubt you support India too?

TheRevivalEditor wrote:
now to say this is nationalism is just crackpots who dont know anything about anything!

Nope - just when you claim you are British in your identity that is nationalism and haram! But then you already know about that - you've got a passport!

TheRevivalEditor wrote:
having an affiliation or supporting your country's football team shouldnt be seen as anything more than mere sporty, footy mad etc ive been to world cup cricket matches, holding paksitan flag, shouting Pakistan Zindabaad- anything wrong with that - is it heck. supporting your countrys cricket team doesnt make you put your country before your deen; any pakistani cricket mad fan will know his affiliation to Islam comes before any nations team.

Having an affiliation with a mandir, helping repair it... shouldn't be seen as nothing more than assisting one's neighbour should it? The occassional dusting of the odd idol... where's the harm in that I ask you? Of course not! Silly crackpots! I still love Islam and I don't make the idols foremost in my religion! Islam does ask us to respect other religions - it's just these extremists making lives difficult for us Smile

TheRevivalEditor wrote:
Nowadays al muhajiroun/HT have scared and confused ppl so much on issue of nationalism its crazy!

These groups don't understand the damage they are doing - soon no Muslim will dust idols, or wash them, or hoover the mandir's cos of the confusion they're creating!
Next they'll be asking us to stop calling ourselves HinduMuslims!!! Can you imagine that! They don't want us to integrate/assimilate - they just think we should interact and nothing more!!! Disgraceful!

TheRevivalEditor wrote:
Nationalism is when your country, its cultures, laws, leadership ets is seen as superior than Islam or you have more love for your nation that Islam or you are paksitani/british first then Muslim then all this would be nationalsim (assabiyah) and then it would apply to the hadith that such people will be sent to teh lowest form of jahannam.

Hinduism is when you love idols more than Islam - I love Islam more than hinduism which comes second! Anyone who loves hinduism more than Islam will be in lowest parts of hell! So there!

erm lily i never said nothing bout thighs i think uve mixed my paragraph and someone elses together as one quote, scroll above. i said knees should be covered.

“O my people! Truly, this life of the world is nothing but a (quick passing) enjoyment, and verily, the hereafter that is the home that will remain forever.” [Ghafir : 39]

Lilly wrote:
Anonymous1 wrote:
Funzo wrote:
...or is this some more ranting from nutters who learnt how to printer?

No doubt they would cite your own words against you and state in similar terms: is this a rant from a nutter who can't even string a sentence together? Smile

there is a thing call "typo"

Ironic - especially when you are cynical about people's abilities to use a printer!

Lilly wrote:

thighs??? wouaw...i thought someone would argue with me about the "below/above the knee" but thighs?? and what sort of Muslim would want to show off their thighs?

I guess those who are Maliki sort of Muslims...many north africans have no problem with the issue of thighs if you ever visit them...

@anonymous. for the printer stuff, you're just playing with words, it was just the way Funzo said it but if you want to go down that path (and i wont follow you for long) he used the word "nutter" which mean the person is crazy...crazy person might not be so good at using printers...

@the thigh thing

i've grown up more than half my life with North African people. I don't recall short-wearers or my dad complaining about his mates wearing shorts which showed their thighs.

Is it true? Is it kind? Is it necessary?

Lilly wrote:
@anonymous. for the printer stuff, you're just playing with words, it was just the way Funzo said it but if you want to go down that path (and i wont follow you for long) he used the word "nutter" which mean the person is crazy...crazy person might not be so good at using printers...

Point noted

Lilly wrote:
@the thigh thing
i've grown up more than half my life with North African people. I don't recall short-wearers or my dad complaining about his mates wearing shorts which showed their thighs.

Any Moroccans in that mix? They usually follow Maliki fiqh - you'll notice from Moroccan beaches that they usually show their thighs...

Aisha reported that the Messenger of Allah(pbuh) was reclining in his house with thighs and calves uncovered. Abu Bakr asked for permission to enter and he gave him permission while he was like that. He spoke and then Umar asked for permission and he gave him permission while he was like that and he talked with him. Then Uthman asked for permission and the Messenger of Allah, sat up and straightened his garment. He entered and spoke with him and then left. Aisha said, "Abu Bakr entered and you were not concerned. Umar entered and you were not concerned. Then 'Uthman entered and you sat up and straightened your garment." He said, "Should I not be modest before a man before whom the angels are modest?" Modesty is a virtue.(Muslim)
Ibn Abi Zayd Al Qayrawani al Maliki's Risala (Maliki school of thought)

Lilly wrote:
@anonymous. for the printer stuff, you're just playing with words, it was just the way Funzo said it but if you want to go down that path (and i wont follow you for long) he used the word "nutter" which mean the person is crazy...crazy person might not be so good at using printers...

Point noted

Lilly wrote:
@the thigh thing
i've grown up more than half my life with North African people. I don't recall short-wearers or my dad complaining about his mates wearing shorts which showed their thighs.

Any Moroccans in that mix? They usually follow Maliki fiqh - you'll notice from Moroccan beaches that they usually show their thighs...

Aisha reported that the Messenger of Allah(pbuh) was reclining in his house with thighs and calves uncovered. Abu Bakr asked for permission to enter and he gave him permission while he was like that. He spoke and then Umar asked for permission and he gave him permission while he was like that and he talked with him. Then Uthman asked for permission and the Messenger of Allah, sat up and straightened his garment. He entered and spoke with him and then left. Aisha said, "Abu Bakr entered and you were not concerned. Umar entered and you were not concerned. Then 'Uthman entered and you sat up and straightened your garment." He said, "Should I not be modest before a man before whom the angels are modest?" Modesty is a virtue.(Muslim)
Ibn Abi Zayd Al Qayrawani al Maliki's Risala (Maliki school of thought)

Anonymous1 wrote:
you'll notice from Moroccan beaches that they usually show their thighs...

are you saying that u go to beaches and start looking at people's uncovered legs?

Brother/sister, we are encouraged not to reveal/boast about our sins.

Don't just do something! Stand there.

Anonymous1 wrote:
Funzo wrote:
...or is this some more ranting from nutters who learnt how to printer?

No doubt they would cite your own words against you and state in similar terms: is this a rant from a nutter who can't even string a sentence together? Smile


Ohh im sorry i need to remind myself you dont have the mental capacity to read a sentence with a typo in it, perhaps you would like to address the argument and the group i referenced rather than a missing word? better yet why dont you just go on 7cgen?? or a forum which other simmilar minded people will agree with every single single word you post.

Those who danced were thought to be quite insane, by those who couldn't hear the music...

Ya'qub wrote:
Anonymous1 wrote:
you'll notice from Moroccan beaches that they usually show their thighs...

are you saying that u go to beaches and start looking at people's uncovered legs?

Brother/sister, we are encouraged not to reveal/boast about our sins.

You jump the gun - first glance is not sinful! One can be aware that many of the British are half naked in summer months without going out and staring at them...

Funzo wrote:
Anonymous1 wrote:
Funzo wrote:
...or is this some more ranting from nutters who learnt how to printer?

No doubt they would cite your own words against you and state in similar terms: is this a rant from a nutter who can't even string a sentence together? Smile


Ohh im sorry i need to remind myself you dont have the mental capacity to read a sentence with a typo in it, perhaps you would like to address the argument and the group i referenced rather than a missing word? better yet why dont you just go on 7cgen?? or a forum which other simmilar minded people will agree with every single single word you post.

If you're going to insult intelligence of Muslims (through questioning their ability to use a simple printer!) try to make sure you don't expose your inability to use a keyboard - otherwise the irony of the situation is visible to readers!

And it doesn't help when your point falls flat on its face, to insult those pointing it out - you sound like a bigger idiot and the post then focuses more and more on your inability to carry off a simple "sarcastic remark"!

The fact the conversation is more about an insult and its resulting fallout than the original topic shows a lot about the intelligence of EVERYONE involved.

Don't just do something! Stand there.

Anonymous1 wrote:
Ya'qub wrote:
Anonymous1 wrote:
you'll notice from Moroccan beaches that they usually show their thighs...

are you saying that u go to beaches and start looking at people's uncovered legs?

Brother/sister, we are encouraged not to reveal/boast about our sins.

You jump the gun - first glance is not sinful! One can be aware that many of the British are half naked in summer months without going out and staring at them...

So I assume you were only at the beach to ask for directions away from it?

Don't just do something! Stand there.

Anonymous1 wrote:
TheRevivalEditor wrote:
Rule no 1- al muhajiroun are a bunch of crackpots and most people will back me up on this....

So it's ok to insult those you disagree with but you don't like it when others "insult" you - hmmmmm looks like a double standard... one should at least try to be consistent Smile

And it's interesting you need the majority to tell you ALM are "crackpots" - most Muslims have not even heard of them or of you!

TheRevivalEditor wrote:
these were the guys after 9/11 held a conference called the magnificent 19- after the 19 suicide bombers who flew the planes in twin towers. now if that isnt distateful and damaging to Islam/Muslims then i dont know what to say....

You obviously didn't see the videos reporters picked up of Muslim pleasure around the world that the US got what it's been doling out for years... hmmmmm or is this just a little bit of selectivism for people you hate?

TheRevivalEditor wrote:
watching football, supporting a FOOTBALL team is just fun, enjoyable....

Of course it is - staring at non-Muslim men with naked thighs kicking a ball around - whilst Muslims around the world are being oppressed, Islam is being villified... let's encurage all Muslims to just watch football - it's fun - isn't that the purpose of our lives? Smile

TheRevivalEditor wrote:
i'll be supporting England...

Now why does that not surprise me? Given you are a BritishHinduMuslim no doubt you support India too?

TheRevivalEditor wrote:
now to say this is nationalism is just crackpots who dont know anything about anything!

Nope - just when you claim you are British in your identity that is nationalism and haram! But then you already know about that - you've got a passport!

TheRevivalEditor wrote:
having an affiliation or supporting your country's football team shouldnt be seen as anything more than mere sporty, footy mad etc ive been to world cup cricket matches, holding paksitan flag, shouting Pakistan Zindabaad- anything wrong with that - is it heck. supporting your countrys cricket team doesnt make you put your country before your deen; any pakistani cricket mad fan will know his affiliation to Islam comes before any nations team.

Having an affiliation with a mandir, helping repair it... shouldn't be seen as nothing more than assisting one's neighbour should it? The occassional dusting of the odd idol... where's the harm in that I ask you? Of course not! Silly crackpots! I still love Islam and I don't make the idols foremost in my religion! Islam does ask us to respect other religions - it's just these extremists making lives difficult for us Smile

TheRevivalEditor wrote:
Nowadays al muhajiroun/HT have scared and confused ppl so much on issue of nationalism its crazy!

These groups don't understand the damage they are doing - soon no Muslim will dust idols, or wash them, or hoover the mandir's cos of the confusion they're creating!
Next they'll be asking us to stop calling ourselves HinduMuslims!!! Can you imagine that! They don't want us to integrate/assimilate - they just think we should interact and nothing more!!! Disgraceful!

TheRevivalEditor wrote:
Nationalism is when your country, its cultures, laws, leadership ets is seen as superior than Islam or you have more love for your nation that Islam or you are paksitani/british first then Muslim then all this would be nationalsim (assabiyah) and then it would apply to the hadith that such people will be sent to teh lowest form of jahannam.

Hinduism is when you love idols more than Islam - I love Islam more than hinduism which comes second! Anyone who loves hinduism more than Islam will be in lowest parts of hell! So there!

a childish responce to my points
if you dont have strong arguments or cant refute them so be it; but dont just bang on about the same thing on every topic and when you are questioned u give silly answers....
u called me a British HINDU Muslim in ur rant above!!
accusing me of SHIRK wont be taken lightly!

 

Ya'qub wrote:
The fact the conversation is more about an insult and its resulting fallout than the original topic shows a lot about the intelligence of EVERYONE involved.

Thank you for joining the fallout - you might not have noticed but your comment includes you within the set!

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