Submitted by As i see it (not verified) on 10 January, 2015 - 18:08 #1
Good article but i suggest you re-read the article below on the revival site.
No Country, Religion, Race or People are perfect. We just have to try our best to get along as Humans. Regardless of the colour of your skin, you bleed red blood. Regardles of the colour of your skin, you are predjudiced in favour of people of your skin colour. It is just part of Humanities Nature. But we still have to get along as best we can and show the best of our commom humanity, not the worst.
Integration and assimilation are IMO two different things.
Integration includes mutual respect and understanding that differences exist.
Assimilation doesn't and in its implementation risks a reaction from both the society being assimilated and the one being assimilated into.
Another issue is one of the "uncanny valley" effect - the human psyche reacts almost violently against an image that is presented as identical but it can notice differences.
There have always been multiple communities and attempts to have one community of identical automatons will always fail or lead to violence.
(Chances are that France, by trying to force assimilation upon its immigrant population has hit this wall to a greater extent that other places)
Mutual respect, mutual understanding is the way to go.
—
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
Submitted by As i see it (not verified) on 11 January, 2015 - 18:35 #3
(Chances are that France, by trying to force assimilation upon its immigrant population has hit this wall to a greater extent that other places)
Agreed you can try to force people to assimulate, forcing immigrants to conform to local customs. But what about the opposite when immigrants try to force the local population to conform to their ways. When there are sufficient numbers living in an area, forcing the original residents to wither move out, or acept the rules of the majority in the area.
I note two Gulf States Qatar, who allow Christians to openly follow their religion, indeed have allowed a new catholic church to be built. Then you have Saudi were it is illegal to bring in a bible and Christians can only meet at each others homes. To discuss Christianity with fellow worker, who may be Muslim is not allowed, but they can openly tell you the benefits of Islam.
The EU allow people of other faiths to follow their own faiths, indeed many mosques have been built (with saudi funds) the only imposition is the refusal of the daily call to prayer. Even though immigrants complain and say that they are discriminated against. As they have to listen to Church bells on Sundays.
As the Revival article states you have got to learn our customs, at least to understand our viewpoint, You can go to a pub, have a game of darts, socialise with the host population. You can buy a soft drink. Yes people can get drunk and be noisy in pubs, but it is more the exception then the rule. If you are a non-drinker then you would be the one nominated to drive (and be very popular)
But what about the opposite when immigrants try to force the local population to conform to their ways. When there are sufficient numbers living in an area, forcing the original residents to wither move out, or acept the rules of the majority in the area.
I just wanted to post my opposition to this occurring.
Any idea of a "Shariah Compliant zone" coming into force when the Muslim population becomes the majority and non Muslims are forced to take up islamic and Muslim customs ae alien concepts to me as Islamic rules do not apply to non Muslims and any Muslim trying to force these on non Muslims (other than maybe as basis for state law) lacks sufficient comprehension of Islamic rules to be given such a position.
—
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
There is much hullabaloo about integration. The purpose is foul i.e. just to target Muslims. Nothing is being said about the Hindus or Sikhs who just like Muslims wish to preserve their thousands of year old tried and tested culture.
About integration one can ask as to which society is integrated in Britain? If Britain is so integrated then why do we see the " Clash of civilisations" spill out in the streets of British cities in most violent form. We can see or hear about the misdeeds of such civilisation, during almost every weekend, in many towns and cities of Britain.
Does anyone remember the clash of Mrs Thatcher's civilisation with that of Mr. Arthur Scargill's at mine heads of Yorkshire? Does this and mountain of other evidences, not prove that Britain is not an integrated society?
Here is another example. An English colleague of a Muslim confided to him that how lucky were Muslims. He said that all of you Muslims may or may not go to Paradise in the next life, but the way I see you lot, you have Paradise here on earth. Asked to explain this, he said that while you are here at work you have utterly no worry as to what your wife must be doing at home. Also while you are at work your wife has no worries about you, and every bit confidant that you may be not be flirting with some female colleague at work but busy doing your days work.
He confided that a majority of us English do not get such peace of mind. In fact most of our life is spent in turmoil and worries.
So who will be prepared to trade peaceful life for life full of turmoil by integrating ?
The following are some thoughts based upon valuable experiences of a learned person who happens to be a Medical doctor.
The British government is again asking us ,Muslims, to adopt the" British values" and to integrate fully into the British way of life.
But many so called "British values" are not acceptable to us.
We would like to confirm again that we practising Muslim believers will never ever adopt or integrate into all these "destructive and immoral values":
-Sexual immorality, sleeping around,affairs,adultery and fornication,illegitimacy,teenage pregnancy, immoral sex education,pills and condoms and Morning after-pill to every one? ( the contraceptive mentality).
-Sexually immoral programmes and messages daily on all TV and many radio channels and in magazines and newspapers.
- The legalisation of homosexuality and homosexual practices(gays and lesbians).
-the culture of death: killing every day 600 innocent unborn babies through abortion. And the killing of our old sick patients after stopping food and fluid to make them die from starvation and dehydration(Mental capacity Bill).
-Alcoholic drinks and drug abuse which are causing hellish problems in all sectors in our society.
-Yob culture
-Gender-bending: women becoming like men and vice versa.
-Disrespect for motherhood and full time mothers.
-Broken families and neglect of elderly parents who are suffering and dying alone.
-Unjust campaign of "Death and destruction" on concocted pretext.
Let us all: people from all faiths(Islam, Christianity...) and from all nationalities: ADOPT FULLY THE DIVINE HUMANE SAFE HEALTHY AND ECONOMICALLY BENEFICIAL VALUES :
*Morality, Chastity and fidelity, heterosexuality.
*Clean safe media.
*The Sacredness of life/Culture of life(no abortion, no assisted suicide and no Euthanasia).
*Avoidance of poisons(alcohol and drugs).
*Clear,natural,healthy,different genders, procreation/full time mothers.
*Healthy, stable extended families with care and love to our weak old parents.
*Peace, not wars.
*No occupation of any one else's land.
Thank GOD, our Christian friends and believers and many other sensible people in our society, do share with us almost all these DIVINE values.
Comments
Good article but i suggest you re-read the article below on the revival site.
No Country, Religion, Race or People are perfect. We just have to try our best to get along as Humans. Regardless of the colour of your skin, you bleed red blood. Regardles of the colour of your skin, you are predjudiced in favour of people of your skin colour. It is just part of Humanities Nature. But we still have to get along as best we can and show the best of our commom humanity, not the worst.
Muslims - You Gotta Integrate!
http://www.therevival.co.uk/article/muslims-you-gotta-integrate
Integration and assimilation are IMO two different things.
Integration includes mutual respect and understanding that differences exist.
Assimilation doesn't and in its implementation risks a reaction from both the society being assimilated and the one being assimilated into.
Another issue is one of the "uncanny valley" effect - the human psyche reacts almost violently against an image that is presented as identical but it can notice differences.
There have always been multiple communities and attempts to have one community of identical automatons will always fail or lead to violence.
(Chances are that France, by trying to force assimilation upon its immigrant population has hit this wall to a greater extent that other places)
Mutual respect, mutual understanding is the way to go.
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
(Chances are that France, by trying to force assimilation upon its immigrant population has hit this wall to a greater extent that other places)
Agreed you can try to force people to assimulate, forcing immigrants to conform to local customs. But what about the opposite when immigrants try to force the local population to conform to their ways. When there are sufficient numbers living in an area, forcing the original residents to wither move out, or acept the rules of the majority in the area.
I note two Gulf States Qatar, who allow Christians to openly follow their religion, indeed have allowed a new catholic church to be built. Then you have Saudi were it is illegal to bring in a bible and Christians can only meet at each others homes. To discuss Christianity with fellow worker, who may be Muslim is not allowed, but they can openly tell you the benefits of Islam.
The EU allow people of other faiths to follow their own faiths, indeed many mosques have been built (with saudi funds) the only imposition is the refusal of the daily call to prayer. Even though immigrants complain and say that they are discriminated against. As they have to listen to Church bells on Sundays.
As the Revival article states you have got to learn our customs, at least to understand our viewpoint, You can go to a pub, have a game of darts, socialise with the host population. You can buy a soft drink. Yes people can get drunk and be noisy in pubs, but it is more the exception then the rule. If you are a non-drinker then you would be the one nominated to drive (and be very popular)
I just wanted to post my opposition to this occurring.
Any idea of a "Shariah Compliant zone" coming into force when the Muslim population becomes the majority and non Muslims are forced to take up islamic and Muslim customs ae alien concepts to me as Islamic rules do not apply to non Muslims and any Muslim trying to force these on non Muslims (other than maybe as basis for state law) lacks sufficient comprehension of Islamic rules to be given such a position.
"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.
There is much hullabaloo about integration. The purpose is foul i.e. just to target Muslims. Nothing is being said about the Hindus or Sikhs who just like Muslims wish to preserve their thousands of year old tried and tested culture.
About integration one can ask as to which society is integrated in Britain? If Britain is so integrated then why do we see the " Clash of civilisations" spill out in the streets of British cities in most violent form. We can see or hear about the misdeeds of such civilisation, during almost every weekend, in many towns and cities of Britain.
Does anyone remember the clash of Mrs Thatcher's civilisation with that of Mr. Arthur Scargill's at mine heads of Yorkshire? Does this and mountain of other evidences, not prove that Britain is not an integrated society?
Here is another example. An English colleague of a Muslim confided to him that how lucky were Muslims. He said that all of you Muslims may or may not go to Paradise in the next life, but the way I see you lot, you have Paradise here on earth. Asked to explain this, he said that while you are here at work you have utterly no worry as to what your wife must be doing at home. Also while you are at work your wife has no worries about you, and every bit confidant that you may be not be flirting with some female colleague at work but busy doing your days work.
He confided that a majority of us English do not get such peace of mind. In fact most of our life is spent in turmoil and worries.
So who will be prepared to trade peaceful life for life full of turmoil by integrating ?
The following are some thoughts based upon valuable experiences of a learned person who happens to be a Medical doctor.
The British government is again asking us ,Muslims, to adopt the" British values" and to integrate fully into the British way of life.
But many so called "British values" are not acceptable to us.
We would like to confirm again that we practising Muslim believers will never ever adopt or integrate into all these "destructive and immoral values":
-Sexual immorality, sleeping around,affairs,adultery and fornication,illegitimacy,teenage pregnancy, immoral sex education,pills and condoms and Morning after-pill to every one? ( the contraceptive mentality).
-Sexually immoral programmes and messages daily on all TV and many radio channels and in magazines and newspapers.
- The legalisation of homosexuality and homosexual practices(gays and lesbians).
-the culture of death: killing every day 600 innocent unborn babies through abortion. And the killing of our old sick patients after stopping food and fluid to make them die from starvation and dehydration(Mental capacity Bill).
-Alcoholic drinks and drug abuse which are causing hellish problems in all sectors in our society.
-Yob culture
-Gender-bending: women becoming like men and vice versa.
-Disrespect for motherhood and full time mothers.
-Broken families and neglect of elderly parents who are suffering and dying alone.
-Unjust campaign of "Death and destruction" on concocted pretext.
Let us all: people from all faiths(Islam, Christianity...) and from all nationalities: ADOPT FULLY THE DIVINE HUMANE SAFE HEALTHY AND ECONOMICALLY BENEFICIAL VALUES :
*Morality, Chastity and fidelity, heterosexuality.
*Clean safe media.
*The Sacredness of life/Culture of life(no abortion, no assisted suicide and no Euthanasia).
*Avoidance of poisons(alcohol and drugs).
*Clear,natural,healthy,different genders, procreation/full time mothers.
*Healthy, stable extended families with care and love to our weak old parents.
*Peace, not wars.
*No occupation of any one else's land.
Thank GOD, our Christian friends and believers and many other sensible people in our society, do share with us almost all these DIVINE values.
We know it's right, so let's do it.
IA