Humans and their flaws

Published by s.b.f on 6 November, 2009 - 22:54

Okay, so I am currently reading a book called 'Evolution and Healing' by Randolph Nesse and George Williams.

I always read the Preface first.

SO they begin by talking about the fact that Ageing has an evolutionary explanation. And they question why anxiety does not have a similiar explanation as well as disorders like Schizophrenia.

Okay so moving on from the Preface, Chapter 1 has the heading 'The Mystery Of Disease'.

And the first paragraph starts:

Why, in a body of such exquisite design, are there thousands flaws and frailties that make us vulnerable to disease?

The second sentence says:

If evolution by natural selection can shape sophisticated mechanisms such as the eye, heart, and brain, why hasn't it shaped ways to prevent near sightedness, heart attacks, and Alzheimer's disease?

So...

a) My first thoughts was that because the body is vulnerable to disease, does that make give it flaws? What do you think?

b) What are the religious views on vulnerability to disease?

c) To what extent do we believe in evolution?

As a reminder: Evolution is:

In biology, evolution is change in the genetic material of a population of organisms from one generation to the next.

d) Why can we not believe in Evolution? What is wrong with believing in the fact that Allah swt is created Evolution and see it as another miracle, another amazing creation of His (swt)?

I'm sorry, if I've overlapped on other forum topics.

Tags: 
evolution
Healing
Darwin
Nesse and Williams
Submitted by You on 6 November, 2009 - 23:06

...Ageing has an evolutionary explanation...

What does that mean? The life expectancy in Zimbabwe is around 35+ I think... is that due to evolution or malnourishment?

Do they give any estimates for age for humans thousands/millions of years ago?

COmparing to the above, the only historical ages I can think of are the Prophet Sallallahu Alaihi Wa Sallam (Peace and Blessings be upon him) - around 63 years, Hadhrat Abu Bakr (ra) - also around 63 years, Hadhrat Umar (ra) - 63 years again, Hadhrat Uthman (ra), around 82 years and finally I cannot remember the age at which Hadhrat Ali (ra) was martyred. However none of these are on a long enough scale for evolution which generally I think talks about much longer time scales.

I would think life expectancy is more linked to nourishment/resources than to evolution...

—

"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.

Submitted by s.b.f on 6 November, 2009 - 23:33

"Ageing has an evolutionary explanation."

Williams, one of the authors of the book, developed this concept.

From this:

First the source argues, that Ageing contradicts what Darwin presented in his theory of Evolution.

Evolution involves Animals adapting gradually over time so they can survive in their environments to reproduce and produce more offsprings.

Therefore, how does this go with Ageing? Since Ageing..involves deteriorating and dying.

...gradually increases mortality with age and decreases the reproductive capacity? How did the genes that influence aging evolve?

Anyway,

There are two concepts of Evolution. One focuses on the Population. One focuses on the individual.

The evolutionary theory of aging is supported by abundant experimental evidence (Rose, 1991). In two classical experiments, researchers were able to delay aging in Drosophila by only allowing older flies to reproduce (Luckinbill and Clare, 1985; Rose, 1989 & 1991). This way, the force of natural selection would no longer decrease with age and, as predicted by the theory, lifespan was extended and aging delayed.

There are lots of tests they have carried out on animals to prove their theory.

But with humans:

A non-programmed theory of mammal ageing [19] that fits with classical evolution theory and Medawar's concept is that different mammal species possess different capabilities for maintenance and repair. Longer lived species possess many mechanisms for offsetting damage due to causes such as oxidation, telomere shortening, and other deteriorative processes that are each more effective than those of shorter lived species. Shorter lived species, having earlier ages of sexual maturity, had less need for longevity and thus did not evolve or retain the more effective repair mechanisms. Damage therefore accumulates more rapidly resulting in earlier manifestations and shorter life span. Since there are a wide variety of ageing manifestations that appear to have very different causes, it is likely that there are many different maintenance and repair functions.

Probably doesn't answer your question.

—

 

Submitted by You on 6 November, 2009 - 23:50

Reading the wikipedia link, atleast the "classical" theories of ageing seem... stupid to me.

There are two concepts of Evolution. One focuses on the Population. One focuses on the individual.

I would think they would be linked? the what affects the individual affects the population.

—

"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.

Submitted by You on 7 November, 2009 - 00:29

s.b.f wrote:
a) My first thoughts was that because the body is vulnerable to disease, does that make give it flaws?

No - a disease is different from a defect. Is a cow "flawed" for being good meat for burgers?

There are also defects, where people are born with diseases that cannot be cured... but in general diseases that are not genetic are not flaws.

s.b.f wrote:
b) What are the religious views on vulnerability to disease?

I think a hadith has been quoted before which goes along the lines of "For every disease that God created - except for death - he also created a cure", so fighting disease, finding its cure is good.

s.b.f wrote:
c) To what extent do we believe in evolution?

Generally Muslims take humans as a "special case", but even here I here there is atleast one theologian who sees no need for humans to be a special case.

s.b.f wrote:
d) Why can we not believe in Evolution? What is wrong with believing in the fact that Allah swt is created Evolution and see it as another miracle, another amazing creation of His (swt)?

There are people who discount it totally - such as Adnan Oktar AKA Harun Yahya, but according to others he is doing a disservice to Islam with his works as it is allowing many to bury their heads in the sand...

—

"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.

Post reply