[TV] John Pilger: The War You Don't See

John Pilger investigates the media's role in war. He traces the history of 'embedded' and independent reporting from the carnage of WWI to the current wars in Afghanistan and Iraq.

This was first broadcast on Tuesday 14 December 2010. Did anyone watch it? what do you make of it all?

, available until around 13 January 2011.

yes, I just watched it all now.

A question is how do you hold people to account who are not held to account by the state? (I am thinking Tony Blair, who IMO should be lynched and hung from a lampost for all to see...)

"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.

I watched it - well the last hour and a bit, i thought that it was refreshing in a way, although my journo module at uni reminded me to think for myself.

He criticised BBC a whole lot i noticed, favoured ITV in many parts (obviously since it was broadcasted on ITV). But i did like how he kept picking at the questions and how uneasy he made many of the people he interviewed.

My heart sunk when they showed the killing of the guys on the street and how they said 'nice' - it really does make you think differently of the word. And when they open-fired at those guys on the street then found the two children in the car - how they told the soldier to leave them - disgusting.

I also found that the way the camera sort of slowly moved up to his face when he was concluding was interesting - made me feel a heightened emphasis on what he was saying (random i know).

Oh and i'm also saddened by the Obama issue - the green party spokesperson put into words what i felt about the whole thing too, people had big hopes for Obama and he let them down (just another politician - sigh). Although perhaps we shouldn't have been so swayed by his 'coloured' skin in the first place.

Jihad of the Nafs (The Struggle of the Soul)

(I thought you had created a toppic on it, but I couldnt find it)

He also had a good go at the itv News aswell, maybe it was earlier. He didn't really show any of the news organisations any respect - mostly because they didnt deserve it.

"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.

You wrote:
(I thought you had created a toppic on it, but I couldnt find it)

On the program? (nope i haven't - i did mention Obama in a blog though - or forum ages ago..)

You wrote:

He also had a good go at the itv News aswell, maybe it was earlier. He didn't really show any of the news organisations any respect - mostly because they didnt deserve it

Maybe it was at the beginning then - because the way i see it, he wasn't as harsh to ITV. ITV and BBC are rival channels so i guess i shouldn't really be expecting much else.

Jihad of the Nafs (The Struggle of the Soul)

i thought it was like erm.. refreshing? It was kinda eye opening too.

The way that he made some of the people he inteveiwed squirm was kinda wow. he did rather well. Shows alot about the news we see on TV, & the whole idea of embedded journalism wasn't fully new to me but it's the first time it was given a name.

When they showed th bombing of Fallujah & then the part where the guy spoke of the boy who died in his arm it really made my heart sink. Why don't we hear more of this reality?

 

i think it was actually better than half the documentaries and all the media that actually show everyone else apart from the uk and america as evil
it actually showed what is happening around the world and how we are kept away from the truth and i liked the bit where they said that its not the fact that we dont know whats happening but the fact that we are all desensitised about what is happening around the world

The Wisest of Man Is Not The One Who Knows, But The One Who Seeks Knowledge In Order To Perform

if you can get me some chocolate that would be great.

@mush - he is also a part of the media. So can you be a part of it.

It's not a conspiracy really - there is only so much poain and suffering you can take before you decide you want to be able to eat your breakfast in peace and turn over to something else where they are blissfully talking about some inconsequential celebrity gossip.

"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.

You wrote:
@mush - he is also a part of the media. So can you be a part of it.

It's not a conspiracy really - there is only so much poain and suffering you can take before you decide you want to be able to eat your breakfast in peace and turn over to something else where they are blissfully talking about some inconsequential celebrity gossip.

erm....ok can you dumb that down abit Wacko

The Wisest of Man Is Not The One Who Knows, But The One Who Seeks Knowledge In Order To Perform

if you can get me some chocolate that would be great.

when you wake up in the morning and are wtching some TV while eating cornflakes or something just before you go to work, do you really want to be told that 20 more people have been killed somewhere?

"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.

I am not against any broader humanitarian concerns and arguments regarding media culpability but Pilger doesn't distinguish between his opinions and a stance of neutrality. Some of his points are well made but others are undermined by his own process, which fails to offer any dissent.

  • It can never be satisfied, the mind, never. -- Wallace Stevens

Didnt I start this topi somewhere else

Actually

he DIDN'T show a bias for ITV
becuse he really laid into that ITV guy
saying
ur biased
u only show one side
and the ITV guy was getting defensive saying we jsut report bla bla bla

You wrote:
when you wake up in the morning and are wtching some TV while eating cornflakes or something just before you go to work, do you really want to be told that 20 more people have been killed somewhere?

I'd rather know than be living in a reality thats not real, surley if everyone could see there would be some kinda change happening,.. Saying we don't want to know isn't fair on those livin through it

 

Exception wrote:
You wrote:
when you wake up in the morning and are wtching some TV while eating cornflakes or something just before you go to work, do you really want to be told that 20 more people have been killed somewhere?

I'd rather know than be living in a reality thats not real, surley if everyone could see there would be some kinda change happening,.. Saying we don't want to know isn't fair on those livin through it

i agree dude
and by the way for you to say you dont want to be told that it seems like you already know that enough people are dying every day but are de-sensitised.

woooooo i feel great i just think i won (with the help from exception)

The Wisest of Man Is Not The One Who Knows, But The One Who Seeks Knowledge In Order To Perform

if you can get me some chocolate that would be great.

(I haven't watched the docu yet, but i do intend to)

mush91 wrote:

i agree dude
and by the way for you to say you dont want to be told that it seems like you already know that enough people are dying every day but are de-sensitised.

woooooo i feel great i just think i won (with the help from exception)


But we sort of do know that people are being killed and are desensitised to some extent...

[Ok I should only talk for myself regarding the latter. But just because I may be a little desensitised doesn't mean i don't care at all or anything!]

"How many people find fault in what they're reading and the fault is in their own understanding" Al Mutanabbi

i'm rather ashamed of the fact that we don't hear these things & when we do we are in some form even a little bit desensitised. I mean i kinda feel pain whenever I hear of children, women, men, living through things I couldn;t imagine but the fact that I can carry on living my life without it affecting me in some sorta HUGE way. makes me feel ashamed of myself.

 

Exception wrote:
i'm rather ashamed of the fact that we don't hear these things & when we do we are in some form even a little bit desensitised. I mean i kinda feel pain whenever I hear of children, women, men, living through things I couldn;t imagine but the fact that I can carry on living my life without it affecting me in some sorta HUGE way. makes me feel ashamed of myself.

It's shameful that we have become desensitised but when it comes to it not having a "huge effect on your life" Then I think thats just well I don't know how to put it but its not really right.

You care about these people and whats happening to them and that is enough for you to have such a drive to want to make peoples lives better, be it just through your rapping or the fundraising etc you do. That IS helping them and you are doing your bit.

It isn't having a huge affect on your life because it isn't *directly* your battle to fight. YOU have your own problems to deal with too. I in no way mean that you shouldn't think of others etc but just mean that it already is having an affect on your life and it doesn't need to have a bigger affect.

Mehh like i said don't really know how to convey what I mean so I'll leave it at that.

Also I feel sort of bad(?) for what i've just said even though i feel its true and I don't know why but i remember some sort of convo with admin and feel he's influenced me somehow! lol silly admin! Blum 3

"How many people find fault in what they're reading and the fault is in their own understanding" Al Mutanabbi

you have your own life to live too - you cannot forever be a martyr for other peoples causes.

Once people grow up and have families etc, their main priority - rightly - is to put food on the table etc. As was mentioned in another topic somewhere, idealism is for the young - who can afford to be foolish.

"For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens 'as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone'" - David Cameron, UK Prime Minister. 13 May 2015.

watched it!

they should have more documentaries like that and i dont even have any words for the people that had a hand in committing these crimes...they will get their comeuppance!

go john pilger!!

(was he the guy that vouched for julian assange, cos he looked familiar)

"Verily, in the remembrance of Allah, do hearts find rest"

You wrote:
idealism is for the young - who can afford to be foolish.

Biggrin

and dont say it like this, you make it sound like a bad thing (which is most probably true) or like you dont know any "young" people.

so, must watch the program, before 13 jan. ok.

about the Obama thing. i think (complete politics illeterate) that people got disappointed by a few people and rightly so. then they started expecting SO much from new/other politicians, stuff that are not possible for a little man in a big world to realise. and then they (unrightly so) get disappointed and it just keeps going with sometimes a rightly so disappointment and most of the time an unrightly so disappointed, and it just keeps sinking.

anyway, i hate politics as much as i hate business. so.. *shrugs* ignore me.

Is it true? Is it kind? Is it necessary?

Lilly wrote:
about the Obama thing. i think (complete politics illeterate) that people got disappointed by a few people and rightly so. then they started expecting SO much from new/other politicians, stuff that are not possible for a little man in a big world to realise. and then they (unrightly so) get disappointed and it just keeps going with sometimes a rightly so disappointment and most of the time an unrightly so disappointed, and it just keeps sinking.

uve noticed it to huh???

"Verily, in the remembrance of Allah, do hearts find rest"

seems from the program that Obama isnt that innocent. the highest military budget in history ever? From the man who thought "from the beginning" that the Iraqi war was wrong? hmm..

watched it, very interesting, a real eyeopener, keep posting interesting stuff like this Admin! then i wont watch my time watching stupid stuff!

Is it true? Is it kind? Is it necessary?

Lilly wrote:
seems from the program that Obama isnt that innocent. the highest military budget in history ever? From the man who thought "from the beginning" that the Iraqi war was wrong? hmm..

watched it, very interesting, a real eyeopener, keep posting interesting stuff like this Admin! then i wont watch my time watching stupid stuff!

+1 Biggrin

"Verily, in the remembrance of Allah, do hearts find rest"